The Trial You’ve All Been Waiting For – Warren Jeffs #2

Dated Oct 7, 2010, with the main body dated Feb 5, 2011

Here Warren Jeffs addresses a warning letter to President Obama – written before and after his extradition to Texas – when he should have been putting together a defense.  Not to leave anyone out, he addresses it to the Peoples of the Nation of the United States of America and the Peoples of the Earth.

This letter, or a similar threat letter (one of at least 5 similar manifestos) was sent to members of Congress.

He threatens Illinois if Obama doesn’t set him free.

Now that the rubber has met the road, he types up a similar letter to the Judge with additional threats.  At least he is being consistent.

~ by FLDS TEXAS on August 1, 2011.

493 Responses to “The Trial You’ve All Been Waiting For – Warren Jeffs #2”

  1. Thanks for all you do admin!

  2. I just saw a funny comment on HuffPost, about the trial. “I talked to God last night and he said…Warren…who???’

  3. Warren is still flailing in the wind, but this nonsense about threatening the Judge with a crippling disease that will end her life spells disaster

    —- for him and his fellow defendants.

    They just have no clue whatsoever.

  4. Twitter is quiet this afternoon. Must be some boring court stuff and nothing to report – or they are all speechless by what they see/hear

  5. In reading the revelations contained in the recusal motion, I note that god’s language was much more coherent on 7/28 than on 7/31.

  6. Well Warren asked the jury be dismissed,,, he had something to say, so the judge dismissed the jury, and Warren gave a 15 tirade of how the court is stomping all over freedom of his beliefs and religion

  7. Thanks for the update DD, please post more when you know.

  8. Does the idiot Bill Medvecky ever come around here?I ran into him on the San Angelo Standard Time forum.What the hell is his problem anyway?

  9. Other than being a wanna-be FLDS? He is an apologist idiot! He use to come her and I think he’s been banned for less than adult behavior, threats and a host of other reasons.

  10. I wish Fred would weigh in on Medwacky.

  11. Fred, Fred….wherefore art thou, Fred??

  12. Warren was up and down like a jack-in-the-box during Ranger Jesse Valdez’ testimony about the Temple Annex/Vault, but he didn’t explode like I thought he might.

    He was amazingly silent during Becky Musser’s testimony.

    He was also silent when the DNA expert said there was a 99.99996% chance he was the father.

  13. Well the DNA is understandable – how can he work religious thees and thous into that?

    With Becky Musser – perhaps he can not contradict her statement of how sacred the documents are?

  14. No no bed or audio tape yet?

  15. Nope. I don’t think that Becky will testify to either the bed or introduce the tape.

  16. Bill Medvecky,

  17. Again, Fred, smitten.

  18. ill bill has been banned from here as I recall, as well as the sltrib and gosanangelo it seems.

    Just as well, he needs to be kept in a lock box.

    Oh the govt shut down some of those too, and now he has lost his groupies.

    Even the flds dont listen to him any more.

  19. Medwacky (LOL,I like that)actually got real upset with me.I cornered him with several personal questions that he didn’t quite like.All of his post sort of blew up in his face.Had he not barged in to the forum,no one would have found out all his dirty deeds.I think that he has painted himself in a corner.Originally,his beef was with the CPS.He defended the FLDS because the CPS raided them.I have exposed the fact that he sees no wrong in betrothal of 12 year old girls to those old FLDS lechers.I called him out on it and he refuses to answer me,so he went away.

  20. I heard the FLDS attorneys said that Wild Bill does not represent the opinions of the FLDS .. wonder how Bill feels about his friends disavowing their relationship with him…

  21. you would think that ‘God’ would know how to correctly spell the judges name. I would hate to see some poor person named Walthers become collateral damage in a holy war…LOL

  22. Yeah, he was supposed to be so buddy buddy with the in crowd at YFZ. Wasn’t there also a coffee ‘meeting’ at a non existant place in Eldorado, around the time of the first trial? And then there was alllll that ‘secret’ info the was getting from compound residents who trusted him? HOGWASH!!! He is a certified mad hatter. I do not miss him!

  23. Medwhacked has some real issues – gained from his time in prison it seems.

    Warren will come out the same way –

    Oh wait! He’s that way going in!

  24. Stamp, with any luck he’s never coming out.

  25. If any of you are able to still catch the Dr. Drew show it is a must watch.

    I’ve spent most of the day watching as much as I can on InSessions/HLN
    ABC. CBS. MSNBC. CNN and still trying to catch all the stuff on the net.

    I am ever so grateful for all the coverage. When I first saw Dr. Drew trying to discuss this case/story last week, I didn’t think he had enough info to ask the right questions etc.

    Tonight I got the feeling he knows exactly which questions to ask. And I must say I rather enjoyed his way.. 🙂

    He had a lawyer on the show first name Mark (not Mark G.) young, attractive young man with family, a little loud but he has a great smile AND a sense of humor. What was really good as it has been with most reporting is that they have talked some law without me having to write anything down to double check. Either I am catching on or everyone is coming down a notch or two with the legal babble.

    And today the coverage was great. Less bahhaaa crap with Warren and the doom of gloom but more on what makes it all tick and all those involved.

    all kinds of stuff going on all over. Thanks Matt Waller and Patrick Dove for the extras. 🙂

    I still love Flora and Sam Brower big time.

  26. Sam Brower was on Joy Behar tonight. I missed it, but have set to record the repeat in the middle of the night.

  27. Here’s an article from the San Angelo paper on today’s court proceedings:

    Appears that evidence from second 12 year old victim will be presented tomorrow, as an lead up the photo of Jeffs kissing the girl was shown to jury, the same one that was posted on this blog.

  28. Here’s an interview of Flora Jessop:

    She felt the FLDS women should also be prosecuted.

  29. I don’t agree that all the mother’s should be prosecuted, but there are some that should, like Sally (lying through her teeth) Jeffs.

  30. I just saw a funny comment on HuffPost, about the trial. “I talked to God last night and he said…Warren…who???’


    I love it!

  31. The RED shirt on Becky!!! Another “in your face” flip-off to warren.

  32. From this article by John Hollenhorst:

    Still waiting in the wings is an audio recording of an alleged sexual assault on the 12-year-old. Private investigator Sam Brower says that tape was seized five years ago, but the judge in Jeffs’ Utah trial ruled it inadmissible in that case.

    “In his own words, he said it was ‘too inflammatory.'” Brower said. “In my opinion, that’s like saying the murder weapon is too inflammatory to introduce in a trial.”

    Brower says he has heard the tape and it shocked him. He says it was apparently recorded in the FLDS temple as Jeffs assaulted the girl.

    The private investigator says two other women were involved in the sex act.


    Didn’t Warren watch motel porn with accompanying wife/wives while he was on the run? Maybe that’s where he got the idea for recording his ritual deflowering.

    That poor child, I bet she was crying.

  33. NOW I am really pissed, the judge in Elisa Wall’s case ruled the rape tape too inflamatory?? WTF with the Utah judges? By the way you may notice that is the very first time I have used any such language!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  34. AND why the ##@@# are there not charges against the two women for accessories to rape!!!!!


  35. Here’s a report on the trial of that felonious profit Warren Jeffs from the British press, so even overseas, this trial is garnering interest.

    Article appears well written IMO.

  36. I’m wondering that same thing, although if you read the dictation from the date in question, it appears that 1 of the girls might have been underage herself.

  37. Today is going to be a good day in Court, for many reasons.

  38. In the real world if a gang member participates in rape as a juvenile they are still prosecuted

  39. And then, if there are mitigating circumstances the judge can impose a suitable sentence. In this case a suitable sentence might be custodial change and a college education…. but the act of the trial would be important in establishing that the rule of law prevails….

  40. Warren elected to be sentenced by the jury.

  41. Just a heads up,,, In Session is focusing on the Warren Jeffs Trial today,, they are interviewing lots of former FLDS and updatinig the trial as it goes

  42. It is COMPLETELY UNACCEPTABLE that the women were not charged as accomplices in a rape. Where is the outrage that this judge has not been removed for ruling that the audiotape was inadmissable ?

  43. @anonymous I LOVED the RED shirt that rebecca Musser wore to!!

  44. The real obvious truth so far is that Warren S. Jeffs is, under the guise of a self-proclaimed “Sent One of God”, speaks from above the US Constitution and these ‘Gentile Laws’. His threats aimed at Judge Walther and the citizens of Schleicher and Tom Green Counties and the State of Texas should inform the Jury that this criminal mindset and total disregard for our laws lead ditrectly to Jeffs criminal acts in some perverted belief that he was conducting himself in a ‘Holy way’ and in accordance with a true and sacred Faith, the limitations placed upon the “Freedom of Religion” by the US Supreme Court, were voluntarily ignored by him. He then is guilty of the proven evidence submitted so far and his proffered defense is not an viable defense for him to espouse. He has to state his baseless and unfounded legal claims himself because a competent lawyer could not assert such a groundless defense without being admonished by the Court, brought up before a State Bar and have his right to practice Law questioned by his professional peers. So the only way for Warren S. Jeffs to afford himself this meager defense is to take control of his own case and put forward this inadequate and ineffective arguments. Warren jwffs in essentially contributing to his own prosecution by this inept and irrelevant strategy, he may be winning his FLDS Church ‘hearts and minds’ but it is a failed effort legally at its very initiation.

  45. I watched interview with Sam Brower on In Session,, I really Like this man, he tells it like it is, and is still pursuing FLDS and the laws they break, and he to doesn’t understand WHY this country isn’t more concerned about Polygamy and sexual assaults of children… will it change FLDS, maybe not,, but it will certainly make them aware the state of Texas will NOT stand for it here

  46. Rebecca Musser has heard the audio tape of the rape of the 12yr old girl and has indentified the voice as that of warren jeffs

  47. I want to know which lawyer helped Jeffs with the motion that threatened the judge. The motion was entered becuase a new rule in Tx Supreme court went into effect on Monday. So some lawyer told him he had that option and must have known what was in the motion??

  48. Interesting manifesto added to the thread header, looks like Warren was already threatening everyone under the sun!


    Esp Illinois. Wonder why?

    And this is when he should have been formulating his defense – guess as we have seen, this is basically IT.

    Threats, begging, intimidation, anything but an admission of guilt.

  49. re: tape not admissible in Utah trial.

    I can almost understand why it was ruled out, because WSJ wasn’t on trial for that rape. He was on trail for forcing Ellissa Walls into an underage marriage in which she was raped.

    I say “almost”, because, when the Utah conviction was overturned on the faulty jury instructions “technicality”, I was confused. On what planet does a jury need to be instructed to consider whether a man intends for a rape to occur when his actions force her into a situation in which she will be required to share another man’s room and bed? Is this really in question?

    If I had a 14-year-old guest in my house, and I forced her to share a bed with a 19-year-old man, would anyone hesitate to say I was an accomplice to her rape? Not in my world. Why is Utah having trouble with this?

    Given that, the ruling that the tape was too inflammatory to admit as evidence really makes me wonder whose side Utah courts are on…

  50. Im wondering if the girl raped while others watched was Merrianne Jeffs, Warren married her in 2005

  51. Utah is on their own side,, and dont want to make waves,, after all its a freaking mormon state, and this crap has been going on in their state for years and years

  52. State witness testifies that Jeffs’ “marriage” to girls not legal. Jeffs objects that God’s Laws trumps. He objects so much the jury is sent out of the room for a few minutes before reconvening (gosanangelo twitter feed) to listen to ranger read other temple documents

  53. Chaps the reasoning behind a ‘Warning to Illinois’ would originate back to when, where and how Joseph Smith, Jr. died while under arrest in the Carthage Jail in Illinois and subsequent pressures that fell upon the Mormon Church to leave the Nauvoo, Illinois settlements. Salt Lake Temple Priesthood pledges secretly required that vengeance should be taken upon the people responsible for these acts. Today, the LDS Church no longer requires such pledges but an orthodox sect, such as the FLDS Church, would likely still be wanting to avenge these past trespasses. Missouri and Arkansas, also, would meet with a fundamentalists harsh judgements owing to Governor Boggs ‘Extermination’ decree and the claimed martydom of Parley Pratt in the Fort Smith area.

  54. I believe the warnings against Illinois were directed towards President Obama, Obama has lived most of his adult life in Illinois, and his wife was raised in that state, Obama has many ties to that state IMO.
    Above in reference to CAJim @ 11:13AM


  56. Deputydog:

    What has been going on for years? After this, I’d believe almost anything.

    The Utah Supreme Court made up their own reality by suggesting that while Jeff’s actions did result in Elissa Wall being forced to share a bed with a 19-year-old man, that doesn’t prove he intended for her to be raped.

    If they can say that with a straight face, then there is no justice for women in Utah.

    If predators know the courts have their back, what else are they getting away with?

    No wonder the prosecutors gave up and sent him to Texas.

    As usual the national media reported the ruling, talked about the impact on Warren Jeff’s other legal issues and then turned to the latest weather updates.

  57. Opportunity for someone via tweet:

    wegotdomain wegotdomain for sale! #FLDS #WarrenJeffs
    1 minute ago Favorite Retweet Reply

  58. I might buy that domain if it was

  59. IRT Illinois being targeted for Obama or Nauvoo, hard to call, and he didnt say.

    Like so many other dictations, he rambles and doesnt make an articulate point. Some of it is downright hilarious.

    Koolaid shooters required to understand them

    It’s like he has handfuls of pixie dust he throws around.

    OH wait its the dust off his shoes.

    Beware Warrens dusty shoes! errrrr Crocs

  60. In the interests of Elissa Wall the fact that she had two miscarriages and had a concern over her first-cousin lineage to Allen Steed but she was counseled by Warren S. Jeffs, as Seer, Revelator and Prophet, that she should remain married to Allen and try to become pregnant for a third time. Jeffs’ counsel and refusal to allow Elissa a release from her celestial seal eliminated a reasonable choice and was criminal abbetting, imo. People without medical degrees shouldn’t give medical advice and as Warren Jeffs is soon to learn, people without legal degrees shouldn’t practice the law. At least during this trial Warren Jeffs is getting a dose of his own medicene. A guilty verdict and stiff sentence should be a good dose of medicene for this wanna-be criminal attorney. Warren’s been in my prayers for three years now and I feel an answer coming, Praise the Lord.

  61. Watergirl: Domains are the easy part. I am so appalled by this whole situation, that I would love to dedicate more time to researching and exposing the entire culture of abuse and the system that enables and supports it. Unfortunately, I have a job, kids and other time-consuming obligations.

    If I were putting a project like this together here is how I would approach it. (Disclosure: I’m speaking as a total outsider who has read a few books, then listened to and read interviews, articles, etc.) I would want the website to be the public face of a much bigger effort.

    I really hope the following is already happening. Since I don’t know, I’ll describe what I think needs to happen anyway: I’d like to see a group form that is a coalition of legal experts, child psychologists, religious scholars, and public policy and PR experts in addition to a core group of people on the ground who have direct, first-hand experience with the crimes this group is committing.

    Here is what I would want to see on the site:

    One: Layout a clear succinct statement of values. Something that, among other things, addresses the right of children to live free and independent lives, free of abuse.

    Two: Present the most compelling, irrefutable instances of crimes and other violations of those values – along with links to supporting evidence.

    Three: Present details of interactions with governing authorities that either enabled or constrained those abuses.

    Four: Present any evidence of missed opportunities to uncover and prosecute crimes.

    Five: Layout a plan for addressing these systematic failures to protect children. This may include passage of new laws in addition to careful monitoring of enforcement of existing laws and the mobilizing of public pressure to ensure officials are doing their jobs.

    Six: Provide regular updates on progress towards justice.

    I’ve said before that I think that waiting for evidence of child rape before acting when children are clearly being systematically abused in other ways – through (among other things) a complete denial of personal freedom and right to self-determination – is wrong.

    All this would require funding, but a credible team, with a clear mission statement and plan (and a competent, transparent accounting system) could form a non-profit and attract the funding they needed to proceed.

    I know there are groups that have formed to help with pieces of the problem. I have not seen one focused on the big picture – or at least I have not yet seen a major effort with funding and connections to people who have the power to effect change and influence public opinion.

    From what I can tell, in spite of some really dedicated people working very, very hard to get the word out, the sad truth is that animals have better funded, more organized advocates than these kids.

  62. I really need to say something here,, Why the hell are all those people in Colorado City still saying they support Warren,, since YFZ was built, Warren has basically Damed all the other compounds to hell,, and YET these stupid ignorant people are still sending MONEY,, filling Warren Jeffs pockets with Money,,still dressing like the 18th century, still harassing people in that town who live there but aren’t in click!
    And the news media keep saying FLDS followers dont have TV to know how the trial is going, blah blah blah,, thats an out and out LIE!! They confiscated over 60 computers from YFZ ranch when the raid took place!
    It just pisses me off, the media acts like all this is new news.

  63. From Twitter —
    lwhitehurst Lindsay Whitehurst
    Quote from #WarrenJeffs journals, abt 3 girls includ. 15 yo victim: “They are pure and innocent and willing to obey”

    They’ve been reading into the testimony some of the documents seized in the 2008 raid, including the journals. Probably leading up to the audio tape of him raping the 12yo.

  64. Jerrie said this on August 2, 2011 at 12:34 PM

    Jerrie, I am just posting what is on Tweet – as I have done over the last couple of days. I just found it interesting that this company is using tweets on a subject to capitalize on it. I am not trying to set anything up. Perhaps what you are describing is similar to Harry Reid’s request for a task force which I don’t believe he ever got.


    This article does not relate to the trial – but, relates to FLDS – can you open a new thread and post it?

    Judge orders Utah to pay polygamous sect’s land trust debts–Polygamy-Trust/

    Bruce Wisan will get his money finally.

  66. Watergirl: Ah, that makes sense. Who wouldn’t want to make money off of Warren Jeff’s name? Gross.

    re: the Task Force. Politicians regularly call for task forces to demonstrate their commitment to an issue. It is usually just political showmanship.

  67. Warren Jeffs continues to object to church documents being admitted into evidence. He has objected or interrupted more than 25 times since court began about 9:15 a.m.

    San Angelo Standard Times Tweet

  68. Rebecca Musser has heard the audio tape of the rape of the 12yr old girl and has indentified the voice as that of warren jeffs

    Can’t you also do an audio analysis was such that voices can be identified? Is such computer analysis of voice as accurate as fingerprints or DNA? I would assume the prosecution wants to cover their bases and prove the voice is indeed Warren’s.

  69. The answer is yes cement. And I’m sure they have already done such analysis.

  70. Did Merrianne Jessops have a child? If so when? and where is that child now? Thank you, I’m a Mommaw in KY and your site has the most information on this trial. As the Mommaw of eleven grand babies, my heart just aches for these abused, mislead children.

  71. Don’t believe she had a child. She went into foster care with a family in New Braunfels, TX. She’s still a minor and I do not know her whereabouts.

    I hope she is no longer a follower and is leading a normal childhood.

  72. Cement – there is technology of voice-print analysis but I don’t know if it was done.

  73. I tried to call InSessions. Got the leave a message after the beep. I am not a beep type person.

    One of the things that they keep asking is what are some of the reasons that so many still continue to follow.

    Look how easy it is for Warren to damn the nation to hell and threaten a Judge in full view of everyone. Not even just little threat but BIG threats many people including the President.

    A lot of people have laughed it off. I don’t know about anyone else here but his threats and doom and gloom talk scare me.

    He has used the blood atonement threat when people disobey him.

    This is a man who has had peoples phones tapped, computers hacked, he has been linked up with outside groups that have known to do awful things.

    With all the crap that has gone on name one agency that anyone that knows some of this inside stuff can call for help. One agency that is truly knowledgeable with the whole story that will help and enforce the laws.

    They couldn’t even e-mail a newspaper outlet in the area and ask for help.
    They have programs in place that condone polygamy.

    Who can they trust?

    I am on the outside and I don’t know who to call. ( Well I actually would call the Texas Rangers but I don’t know how much they know and I don’t know how far they could go. And I’d be afraid they would lock me up for talking crazy)

    As much as this has been out in the public eye there are still so many that just don’t know. It still sounds crazy to us but imagine being a new kid on the block trying to grasp it all.

  74. Jerrie, the HOPE Organization already performs many of the roles you’ve described but they don’t specifically champion or campaign for ‘Kids Rights’ or legalislative action(s). Check out their website and you’ll see alot of what you envision exists there and possibly could be an existing platform to braoden out your ideas.

  75. I caught an interview with Rod Parker on HLN [I think], this morning. He was spouting the usual gobbledegook about how people don’t really get thrown out/lose their fsmily/lose their homes if they disagree…only in a few circumstances… He likened it to a bankruptcy where the bank, who owns your house, throws you out! He did say a child molester was made to leave [at one time]. So the commentator asked, so, if WJ is convicted of child molestation, will he be made to leave..? After a few sputtering attempts at an answer, Parker says, I don’t know what happen to WJ [or words to that effect].

  76. Now that’s funny re rod Parker.

  77. I understand your feelings Walton, I think we all feel the same way,, simply put, there is just so much we can do,,, it takes the Feds to actually investigate all the other compounds, which costs lots of money, which right now, America is short of money….. At Least people like Dr Drew from HLN, and some of the others are talking about FLDS,,, in Fact Dr Drew’s show tonite is about Warren Jeffs.

  78. I agree with Walton! WJ’s has the devil on his side,and we know how powerful he is!!! If you believe in the power of prayer,PRAY! that our Loving and Just GOD will intervene.

  79. Will do, Moose !

  80. Finally a new tweet from gosanangelo.

    Warren still objecting. Judge still telling him to shut up….

  81. From Twitter today —
    #warrenjeffs On an FLDS doc written during christmas day: “Remove the Idolatry of Toys”

    #warrenjeffs objecting more intensely now. Judge: ” this is not the time to make speeches”

    Heard audio of #warrenjeffs giving religious instruction in a vehicle, very garbled, jurors had transcript

  82. Deputydog I understand the money issue. But do you remember when the Arizona 6 were arrested and a few of them got zip and the one guy I think served a day?

    And there was a Judge who also practiced Polygamy? and saw nothing wrong with some of things that were being done.

    there are some really good laws already in place. And there are an awful lot of good law-enforcement people that are willing to do their jobs.

    I don’t understand the Welfare system in Utah that allows a woman with x amount of kids to come in and not claim a daddy and I’ve yet to see anyone talk about these guys paying child support for anyone. Merril kinda maybe. Who really knows.

    I am not talking a raid. I am talking about having an attorney General who doesn’t get up on stage and says he isn’t going to do anything concerning those breaking the law. Or having those that are knowingly breaking the law in positions that are teachers or counslers.

    If they would do one a day.

    Nate Carlisle did an outstanding piece at the Trib some months back. Nate could come up with some info.

    Ben is a go getter.

    Issac Wyler could come up with a local news page and keep everyone posted. I think he’d be really good. And that guy that took the pictures. Wonderful seeing the kids.

    I think it can happen. I think it should happen. I think it will happen.
    I just know it can be done.

    I think Sam Brower could put together a cheat sheet that would help any new recruits concerning law-enforcement and investigators.

    I plan on watching Dr. Drew again. Everyone has been really good about the questions and I am actually enjoying hearing that other people have seen what we have seen.

    hey will Warren have to pay court costs? how about chipping in on the raid? Will Utah be asked to help finance some things?

    hope so.

  83. More reporting from Twitter —

    prosecutor in #warrenjeffs trial tossed down file w evidence on table after upteenth Jeffs objection, pros said court must address abuse


    YES, for Pete’s sake, address the abuse!

  84. gosanangelo
    prosecutor in #warrenjeffs trial tossed down file w evidence on table after upteenth Jeffs objection, pros said court must address abuse
    3 minutes ago

  85. lol i was too late….but if they adress the abuse will it halt the trial for days?

    Hope they tape his mouth shut

  86. Some attorney [sorry I cannot remember his name] was on last night w/Dr Drew. He was asked about Judge Walther’s decision:letting WJ be his own attorney. CLEARLY this man was not familiar with the backround of the numerous delaying tactics and past practices of the flds attorney’s in filing last minute and frivolous motions. He thinks it was a mistake to let a ‘mentally ill’* man act as his own attorney and that the case can be reversed because of that.
    However, other attorney’s disagree on that point. I heard/read that when WJ chose to be his own worst enemy, ie: attorney, he gave up the right to appeal the fact he had bad representation.

    *He and Dr Drew sorta sparred over the ‘mentally ill’ he? Is he faking? Is he delusional:schizophrenic?

  87. From Twitter just now —

    lwhitehurst Lindsay Whitehurst
    NEW: #WarrenJeffs might lose right to represent self & be thrown out of court after he talks over audiotape evidence

  88. If Warren threatens the judge, will there then be cause to appeal and/or demand a new trial on the grounds the judge can’t effectively do her job with a threat hanging over her? Nice little loophole, could be used over and over again.

    Changing the subject: it must really chap Warren’s hide for the U.S. to have a non-Caucasian President.

  89. A psychopath is not considered mentally ill.

  90. Are Iranians mentally ill for believing their chosen anti-jew delusions?

  91. I’m hearing on twitter that there is another audiotape and the vehicle one wasn’t it. Please confirm.

  92. even if his attourneys are reinstated as the prosocution wants, he can still yell out and disrupt the court. What action would be taken in that case?

  93. That’s kinda what the verbal sparring was about.
    Dr Drew says NO WJ is not mentally ill, but that he does have mental issues…two completely different topics. I taped last night’s Joy Behar w/Sam Brower [his book was just delivered to my Kindle!] but haven’t had a chance to watch it, yet.

  94. Warren tipped his hand in his ‘motion.’ He talks about Judge Walther giving him a mistrial. That’s what he’s shooting for. (As to which attorney assisted him? There seems to be one that is quite hung up on ‘non-verbal conduct,’ whatever the heck that is. That would be my guess.)

    Although his behavior is bizarre, he is not legally crazy.

    The criteria is 1) Can he understand the charges against him? 2) Can he assist in his own defense?

    He well satisfied 1) When he lectured the jury about polygamy. The first time he jumped up and said, “I object!” he satisfied number 2. Let alone write a motion.

    He’s a sociopath. It’s what they do.

  95. even if his attourneys are reinstated as the prosocution wants, he can still yell out and disrupt the court. What action would be taken in that case?

    Wasn’t there a case where the defendant’s mouth was taped shut [and he was cuffed to his chair?] cuz he so disruptive? I doubt the judge would go that route. It’s a bit extreme.

  96. AG Eric Nichols needs to not slam files – not let him see he’s getting angry.

    Face him and say, “Warren, you’re not all that.” He’ll go off like a Saturn 5

    No charge.

  97. Since ole Warren is exhibiting strange disruptive behavior in court, they need to do as was done with fellow polygamist Brian David Mitchell, put him in room with video sound feed, reinstate his defense lawyers so he can’t appeal on claim of inadequate defense.

  98. @mc1199 The judge can remove him from the courtroom if he continues to disrupt.

    @ThirdCousin — all the news reports are saying that an audio tape exists of Jeffs raping the 12-year-old in the presence of witnesses. Rebecca Musser has identified the voice as Jeffs. From everything I’ve heard it is supposed to be entered into evidence.

  99. mc1199,

    Are you old enough to remember the Manson trial? They were pulling the same stunts.

    The Judge put him in another room where he could hear the audio. Same for squeaky and the girls, I believe.

  100. Oh yes, I am old enough to remember Manson, et al. That was a true circus, also. All that’s missing are the prairie dressed females sitting on a corner chanting! Oh, and of course the lovely ‘X’ carved on their foreheads!

  101. Wasn’t there a case where the defendant’s mouth was taped shut [and he was cuffed to his chair?] cuz he so disruptive? I doubt the judge would go that route. It’s a bit extreme.


    In some jurisdictions a disruptive defendant can be removed from the courtroom and sent to a private room where he can watch the proceedings on closed circuit TV.

  102. Thanks to all who are posting the tweets. Some of us dinosaurs don’t tweet – so it’s great to be able to read them.

    A Texan: Yeah, I guess these days they would have video. Duh.

    (I need to sue me for that one.)

  103. Change it to singing hymns – and it’s the same deal. That’s probably his next move if he gets put in time out.

    I’d like to see an X carved in the unibrow..

  104. natecarlisle Nate Carlisle
    #WarrenJeffs to remain his own attorney but is pondering if to leave court while audio of his teachings played. Has called teaching sacred.
    3 minutes ago!/search/%23warrenjeffs

  105. juliekan – Thank you. Wow. @ is the person tweeting and # is where you search?

  106. Juliekan – Thank you. Wow.

  107. yes, you can search anyone, like this



  108. Isnt that the blown gasket y’all were betting on to happen yesterday?

    Looks like it happened today – overtalking evidence – they are giving him more rope though ha ha – let him be a loser and get r done!

    The jury enjoys such a show.

    Move the bet up a day, who is closest?

  109. @juliekan – Now I know why the children of the corn snickered in their sleeve when I said I didn’t need a phone with text.

  110. Chaps – I wouldn’t consider it a blown gasket until he physically goes for someone. But that’s just me.

  111. I bet the 12 yo tape is still coming. All they have proved so far is that he raped the 15 yo. They will have to have evidence to prove it on the other child to make that one stick as well.

  112. mc the attorney on Dr. Drew lastnight that you are talking about is Bradshaw from Az. While he said a couple of things that got under my skin he did bring up some valid points.

    Steven Singular was on InSessions today. 🙂 I hooked up with Sam Browers book this morning. I just knew he was a nice guy. I just knew it! 🙂

    I am on page 90 something.

  113. You can look at Twitter with your computer and you don’t even have to have an account – which is free anyway.

    go to

    on left middle – Under follow your interest there is a box – type in: #warrenjeffs (# means follow this subject)

    it will show you all the updates. when new ones come in it will have a bar at top – click on bar to get new ones.

    I thought this was interesting:

    natecarlisle Nate Carlisle
    Regional judge says #WarrenJeffs must reimburse #Texas for cost of defending the refusal motion he filed yesterday. No $ figure specified.

  114. @juliekan – Now I know why the children of the corn snickered in their sleeve when I said I didn’t need a phone with text.

    Miele said this on August 2, 2011 at 5:05 PM

    This made me smile.

  115. Miele at 5:05PM

    *snicker* that’s funny

    well now you have your twitter link and it’s gone awful quiet. warren must have left the room……

  116. walton, the promos say Sam Brower is going to be on HLN on Dr. Drew (and maybe NG?) tonight.

  117. Juliekan – how are they doing this from the Courtroom? Are phones not allowed? Or can they only tweet during a recess?

    Thank you watergirl. Now I have a new toy. I’m starting with #childrenofthecorn – but they’re too smart for that.

  118. has had 3 staff members tag-teaming. So i guess they take turns leaving to tweet if something big happens. I think the SLTrib also has 2 reporters there….

  119. TheChalkOutline Scott Schwebke
    Wow! RT @natecarlisle: Audio tape played in #WarrenJeffs trial has him telling at least 5 females to disrob… (cont)
    1 minute ago!/search/%23warrenjeffs

  120. Wow! RT @natecarlisle: Audio tape played in #WarrenJeffs trial has him telling at least 5 females to disrobe before him so he can train them to be celestial wives.

  121. Here’s where his head’s gonna explode.

  122. The sheriff better make sure his hands are above table grade during this evidence.

  123. Sorry, I probably should have kept that to myself.

  124. Third Cousin — watch out or you’ll have to sue yourself like Miele. 🙂

  125. That would undoubtedly be expensive, as I would have to foot the bill to defend both sides. What was Miele’s transgression?

  126. Nate Carlisle is on twitter continuing to report re. the rape tape — not sexually explicit for the 1st 40 minutes. I’m seeing zero from anyone else. Is this for real?

  127. The sheriff better make sure his hands are above table grade during this evidence.

    I don’t care who you are – that there is funny.

  128. SBunne – that’s what I’ve been so afraid of – that it will not be explicit enough and that it could be explained away.

  129. Latest from Nate Carlisle of SLTribune —

    natecarlisle Nate Carlisle
    Typed an update on #WarrenJeffs and sent it to office. The last hour could not have been articulated over phone.

  130. His tweet says that the 1st 40 min. are not graphic, but then follows up with another tweet stating that he had just sent his report in b/c “the past hour” couldn’t be properly articulated over the phone….Let me see if I can copy and paste…

    Nate Carlisle
    natecarlisle Nate Carlisle
    Typed an update on #WarrenJeffs and sent it to office. The last hour could not have been articulated over phone.…
    6 minutes ago
    Nate Carlisle
    natecarlisle Nate Carlisle
    #WarrenJeffs did not graphically discuss sex in 1st 40 min of tape but said females w/ him would one day comfort him sexually.
    28 minutes ago
    Nate Carlisle
    natecarlisle Nate Carlisle
    Audio tape played in #WarrenJeffs trial has him telling at least 5 females to disrobe before him so he can train them to be celestial wives.
    32 minutes ago

  131. I read the article in full (link above to SLTrib). It gives much more detail — be sure to scroll past ads and use Next Page. It’s 3 pages long. However, I did not see any additional details on the tapes Nate mentioned where he instructed the girls to disrobe so he could instruct them in becoming celestial wives.

  132. Wow! RT @natecarlisle: Audio tape played in #WarrenJeffs trial has him telling at least 5 females to disrobe before him so he can train them to be celestial wives.


    What a perv.

  133. That should be “where JEFFS instructed the girls to disrobe …”

  134. SLTrib updating fast and crazy!

    San Angelo, Texas • Polygamous sect leader Warren Jeffs was heard on an audio recording played Tuesday telling at least five females to disrobe in front of him so they could receive training on how to be celestial wives.

    Prosecutors presented evidence that the recording was made in late 2004, and that one of the females present was the girl Jeffs had “married” earlier that year at age 14.

    Jeffs — the leader and prophet of the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints — is on trial for allegedly sexually abusing the 14 year old girl and a 12-year-old, whom he purportedly took as plural wives.

    On the audio recording, Jeffs is heard telling the females they must cooperate with their sister wives in many ways, including in sex.

    His language is vague and filled with spiritual references, but he seems to imply such cooperation is needed to reach heaven.

    “The fullness of the law of Sarah is for quorums of wives to be with me to be a comfort,” Jeffs is heard saying. “Yes, even physically, for I need more than one wife to be with me at a time.”

    “The lord has shown me that in heaven the gods are with quorums of women when they conceive children,” Jeffs says a few minutes later in the recording.

    He also tells his audience to be ready to assist sister wives “in their unclothed conditions.”

  135. Okay,, my understanding is the court will hear THREE tapes, maybe this is #2 tape?

  136. I understand that closing arguements wont be till tomorrow,, so maybe the jury will hear the 3rd tape tomorrow,,, But from what ive heard so far,, Warren Jeffs is condoning sex between sister wives with each other

  137. Did you know that Warren Jeffs or someone purporting to be him has his own twitter account?

  138. TexasMonthly Texas Monthly
    #WarrenJeffs gave 12 girls, including 1 of his alleged victims, specific instructions on how to groom themselves, shave their underarms

  139. DD: I understand that closing arguements wont be till tomorrow,, so maybe the jury will hear the 3rd tape tomorrow,,, But from what ive heard so far,, Warren Jeffs is condoning sex between sister wives with each other


    But I’m sure he means only when they’re with him.

    BTW, I wonder if the group sex is something only Warren gets to enjoy, or if all the Priesthood men are encouraged to engage in it. Since not once did I see group sex mentioned in all the autobiographies of former FLDS women I’ve read . . . I’m guessing Door #1.

  140. Wow – I continue to be stunned

    I see know why Willie Jessop said that about Warren finally.

    And there is undoubtedly more – they havent even hit the Temple tape yet.

    No wonder Warren cant keep his clap trap shut in the courtroom.

    He’s cooked and steam is blowin from the kettle!

  141. If you read the dictations carefully Warren talks about group sex alot,, when he was on the run,, remember he always had naomi, and other wives with him,, massaging him, etc

  142. He and severals of his wives watched PORN together,, alot evidently,, OF course warren always said it was to SHOW the wives,, how evil the outside world is,, PERVERT

  143. gosanangelo
    State says another tape may be heard tonight. Judge says be back At 8 pm, recessed right now. May finish all evidence in guilt phase tonight

  144. gosanangelo
    State may finish giving evidence in #warrenjeffs tonight, but may not give final arguments until tomorrow
    1 minute ago!/search/%23warrenjeffs

    so warren is not putting on a defense?

    since closing statements aren’t “sacred”, I guess Lyle will hear the state talk about warren’s pornographic activities?

  145. UK paper had a good article:

  146. I wish Id gone to the trial today, but they said it was packed today

  147. DD1 – I remember reading that. Also, when he was out running from the law he returned to find the wives had their hands on each other. Do you remember that?

    He went into great detail about giving them a ‘training’ to keep their hands off each other.

  148. Even knowing that the tape was probably going to be played, I’m more disturbed by it than I thought I would be. I feel humiliated on behalf of these girls and young women who were recorded being obedient to the only authority they’ve ever known — and then having it publicly aired. I kinow and accept that it had to be done, but as much as I hate to admit it, part of me wants to holler Sacred! Private! right along with Mr. Sicko. For different reasons though.

    Does anyone keep in contact with folks in Short Creek or YFZ? Is all well there?

  149. This is very stunner to me, too! There are past accounts from some of Brigham Young’s wives who stated that he preferred menage a` trois over other forms of celestial bliss. The landing standing and secreted ordinances and rituals of Temple ceremonies is more credible on why ‘blood atonements’ were made if any covert practices should become revealed.

    Why these were being recorded must have been related to instructional purposes apart from live participations. Ancient sex practices at pagan temples are known to have existed but this for me is a first time knowing that the practices were within the FLDS Church YFZ Temple. I believe these practices will prove to have come from the past and will be defended as sacrosanct to the fanatical FLDS Church ‘Templebuilders’. Seems to be a definite relic ritual and more pagan or polytheist than part of any modern religions.

    The damage done to the women in these sessions would be extremely belittling and devaluing of their self worth or personal esteem, it boggles my mind. Patriarchal predatory perversion and pedophilia at it’s most wicked and evil, absolutely stunning revelations.

  150. No, the comment about the sheriff keeping his hands above the table isn’t funny. If it’s not funny for an old man to rape a young girl, it’s SURELY not funny for a sheriff to jack off over it.

    Good hell, people. Keep your logic, reason, and morals in check, will you? Just because we’re discussing an amoral pervert doesn’t give us free license. It makes me wonder about some of you…..

  151. I’m truly sorry, anon. Won’t happen again. I’m don’t normally say such things.

  152. Dont you think it was horrifying for Elissa Wall to actually be in Court and personally testify against Warren Jeffs, going into detail how she was forced to marry someone she didn’t want to marry,, and then having miscarriage after miscarrage and Warren demanding she get pregnant again and again?? I certainly do,,
    Sexual Assault should NEVER be a private matter, thats what happened to these two little girls and as far as Im concerned, the mother participated by handking thier children over to Warren,, and should be accountable for that.

  153. Thats the WHOLE problem people,, All this has been secret,, and therefore allowed to continue~~~

  154. Flora – If you are reading this. Hang tough. Ya did good kid.

  155. Could someone who has reviewed all the tweets and press releases for today’s proceedings please provide a synopsis of today’s testimony ? I certainly would appreciate it.

  156. Wow, very powerful tonight on HLN Dr. Drew, Sam Brower and Flora Jessop. Flora just to let you know you are my hero and have been my hero for a long time. Darlin’ keep up the good fight, we have your back

  157. What I’d like to know is who typed up this “revelation” Warren delivered yesterday? I can’t see Warren sullying himself on the keyboard.

    Also, I bought Sam Brower’s book and started reading it. And then I had to stop reading it because I was getting sick of getting hammered by all the cr*p that the alleged government officials in the Creek were getting away with. I know, especially since I graduated from law school over 20 years ago, that I shouldn’t be naive about this, but I simply do not understand how this has gone on for so long and still goes on?

  158. Speaking of Flora, she will be on AC 360 shortly.

  159. Oh anon, I wasn’t talking about the sheriff, I meant WSJ.

  160. BIB – Someone like Connie will do it better – and the Judge still has the Court in session. I wonder if some who are in Court will check in later?

    The big news was the Texas AG played two tapes of Warren giving his junior wives ‘training.’ Third tape is on deck?

    It seems he allegedly likes more than one at a time. Double shudder. Like he had six but wanted seven.

    He bores them to tears before he allegedly rapes them while they are disrobed.

    I lifted this quote from the daily mail:

    “honorable vessels, property of your husband’s kingdom”

    That’s how he views them and apparently says so to their face.

    About a creepy a day as I can remember.

    Thank goodness for a little comic relief from Third Cousin about the Sheriff making sure Mr. Jeffs keeps his hands above the table while they played the tapes. DD1 rightly pointed out Warren appears to like porn – as was revealed in his dictations.

    Didn’t you teach me reading was FUNdamental? Or was it to give errant children laudanum in the parlor?

  161. Putting this evidence out into the open and knowledge is the Press & Public’s chance to voice change, action and enforcement. The Jury has to be in shock, there is really no way to be prepared for such unadulterated group sex tutorials being conducted within a religious setting, seems evil to demonic, jurors must be reeling. If closing statements are made tomorrow the deliberations will be short lived in my opinion, unanimity in probably the first vote quorum.

  162. Okay,, I know they resumed Court at 8:00 tonite,, and yet not ONE tweet from the courtroom so far,,, Im getting anxious since, its been over an hour, I wish someone would tweet who is in the trial

  163. Mirele – Have you ever sued yourself anonymously and then answered yourself nothing?

    You said:

    I simply do not understand how this has gone on for so long and still goes on?

    You’re not the Lone Ranger.

  164. Katy_Vine Katy Vine
    Court in recess for the night. #warrenjeffs

  165. I’ll ask TexasConnie to create a synopsis.

  166. BIB – Good idea.

  167. Nate Carlisle just tweeted prosecutors tonight showed evidence Mr. Jeffs alleged victim was in Texas when she conceived his child.

    OK. How do you do that?

  168. gosanangelo
    State still has more evidence for tomorrow when #warrenjeffs trial starts at 9am again, state plans to close on guilt innocence

  169. Court has finally recessed. Prosecution has not finished presenting case. All my info comes from 3 reporters on Twitter. You do not have to subscribe to Twitter to see their content, and they each posted only a handful of tweets today. (They have to wait for a break, evidently.)

    Forgive me for not compiling a complete synopsis, but my brain is pretty fried from trying to get all my work done today as well as keep up with the news. I will post the links to the reporters in individual comments so my comments don’t get snagged in moderation.

    It will take probably 2 minutes to click all 3 links and get up to date. Stay tuned …

  170. This link will take you to the San Angelo newspaper on Twitter:

  171. This link will take you to Nate Carlisle of the SL Tribune:

    He was published the most tweets regarding the trial.

  172. This link is to the official polygamy reporter on Twitter:

  173. Sorry, the official polygamy reporter for the SL Tribune. Told y’all my brain was fried. **sizzle**

  174. Miele: No, my goal is to stay far away from the legal system after tangling with a space-alien cult in the 1990s.

    Does anyone know who typed up Warren’s “revelation”?

  175. Story for tomorrow’s print edition of San Angelo newspaper:

  176. Just to be clear — I am glad that the audio tapes were made and available/admissible to LE. They needed to be presented. That said, I still feel bad for the girls and women on those tapes whether they ever realize what has happened to them or not. I wholeheartedly applaud Elissa Wall’s bravery and am in no way trying to minimize her accomplishment. I do, however, have pity for her still-sleeping sisters.

  177. That was SBunne at 10:10 p.m. BTW

  178. Nate Carlisle just tweeted prosecutors tonight showed evidence Mr. Jeffs alleged victim was in Texas when she conceived his child.

    OK. How do you do that?

    Miele said this on August 2, 2011 at 9:37 PM

    I guess some more of his super duper records.

    It supports Texas’s jurisdiction for this trial.

  179. SBunne – I hope the girls who were violated on those audio tapes are not watching coverage of the trial. It’s hard to imagine the heartache. I hope what comes out of this trial is so much increased awareness of this cult that state/federal government step up intervention and law enforcement.

  180. They’d probably just be ecstatic that they weren’t called in to testify.

  181. Im wondering if the girl raped while others watched was Merrianne Jeffs, Warren married her in 2005
    Deputydog1 said this on August 2, 2011 at 10:56 AM

    Warren married Merrianne in 2006.

  182. wow! Dr. Drew show inside of 10 minutes had me almost leaping out of my chair a couple of times. Good show. Dr. Drew and attorney Mark Eiglarsh both said that they can’t help but think about this story and the Children.

    I felt bad for Flora. Tough day for her and I can’t say enough how much respect I have for her.

    I’d like to see Mark Eiglarsh and Shurtleff debate on the show. 🙂 My money is on Mark Eiglarsh.

  183. TexasMonthly Texas Monthly
    #WarrenJeffs gave 12 girls, including 1 of his alleged victims, specific instructions on how to groom themselves, shave their underarms

    Also about clipping their p*b!c hair.

  184. No, the comment about the sheriff keeping his hands above the table isn’t funny. If it’s not funny for an old man to rape a young girl, it’s SURELY not funny for a sheriff to jack off over it.
    Good hell, people. Keep your logic, reason, and morals in check, will you? Just because we’re discussing an amoral pervert doesn’t give us free license. It makes me wonder about some of you…..
    Anonymous said this on August 2, 2011 at 8:37 PM

    Get a grip, she was talking about the Sheriff making sure Warren’s hands were above the table, not the Sheriff’s.

  185. I’d like to see Mark Eiglarsh and Shurtleff debate on the show. My money is on Mark Eiglarsh.
    Walton said this on August 2, 2011 at 10:51 PM

    I would LOVE to see that too! Kudos to Dr. Drew and HLN for keeping this story alive.

    And I echo your respect for Flora. It had to be tough sitting in that trial the last few days.

  186. Nate Carlisle just tweeted prosecutors tonight showed evidence Mr. Jeffs alleged victim was in Texas when she conceived his child.
    OK. How do you do that?
    Miele said this on August 2, 2011 at 9:37 PM

    Because Warren dictated about her frequently and it was always that she was at R17. He even dictated that she conceived in Heavenly Session. Also, he gave her a pregnancy test himself.

  187. Does anyone know who typed up Warren’s “revelation”?
    mirele said this on August 2, 2011 at 10:03 PM

    It is believed to have been worked on by Gerald Ratliff, an attorney here in San Angelo.

  188. Why does everyone keep saying it must be tough for Flora to sit through the trial? She left before Warren Jeffs ever came to power.

  189. Flora was also abused when she was a child. Sometimes the pain and hurt will surface when a memory is triggered.

    Black and blue marks on the inside sometimes never heal. 😦

    Do you guys remember Ruth? She was in the film Banking on Heaven. If you listened closely she often defended the very thing that caused her pain.

  190. Because Warren dictated about her frequently and it was always that she was at R17. He even dictated that she conceived in Heavenly Session. Also, he gave her a pregnancy test himself.

    Oakie Doakie. I guess that would do it. Thank you.

  191. Looks like everyone beat me here tonight. It was a marathon court session. There were actually 3 tapes played today, but 2 of them were played together without stopping so most didn’t realize it was actually 2 different lessons about the same subject, one was a private training to ladies along with an ordinance of sealing the love of God for ladies.

    The 2nd playing, 3rd tape was Training to 12 ladies. This one was totally weird, everyone seemed to be nekkid and then put on white robes. This is where they talked about grooming.

    As for Veda, there were very specific Priesthood Records that indicated she was at the YFZ from before she conceived until after she gave birth to Sereena. I guess Warren thinks he’s an OB along with being a profit, because at the end of September he was convinced she was fixing to give birth any moment. It was the middle of October. Just shows he’s not very good at profitizing.

    The evidence about Merrianne will be tomorrow.

    As for Flora, let’s just say there are a lot of people in the Courtroom who have been hurt by Warren and continue to be hurt by him.

  192. Oh yes, Dr. Sampson, a Law professor at UT brought a moment of levity to the proceedings this morning when he let everyone know that his Texas Family Code Annotated was available for purchase.

  193. WTW, this parallels temple ordinances. I have to say that I haven’t been through an endowment, being an apostate and all, but this hits home on my info. I’m in rural hell, take my comments and limited access accordingly.

  194. okay, I had heard rumors of lesbian acts and group sex, but to see it in open court with audio proof is truly sickening. Here is a question:
    Did Warren learn this behavior from his dad? if not, who?
    I am reeling mentally, and literally sick to my stomach to think these sick bastards were people who I sat in awe of as a youth. I wonder how far back this behavior goes in lds lore. The thing about Brigham Young I had never heard, but dosen’t surprise me if true.
    I wonder if I would have left when I did if I wasn’t a bit of an outcast due to my social caste. I know I would have left eventually, but glad I left when young and still single. I remember one motive of mine at the time was that I didn’t have a chance of being married to a pretty or smart girl, because of my last name.
    These revelations about the flds, as well as my studies about Joseph Smith have destroyed my faith in mormonism at all (not that theres anything wrong with that 🙂 )

  195. LTG – Your words are moving. This trial brings up a lot of personal stuff for me too.

  196. Thanks, third cousin.
    I sit here watching Dr Drew and am literally sick to my stomach

  197. I’m really glad we all have each other here on this blog.

  198. I am elated that the Texas trial is under way, but still want my 10 pounds of flesh in Utah! Warren is putting on the show of the century, one his attorneys wouldn’t of allowed EVER! Now I have my dialog with Orrin Hatch’s attorney, the recordings with the FBI & Attorney Generals Offices, the issues with Colorado City attorneys Snow & Nuffer, Ron Thompson the Hildale Attorney, William Ekstrom Jr the former Mohave County District Attorney, the RCMP in Canada, the FBI in several sates and so on. Warren was evil when I filed with P.O.S.T. in the year 2000, 11 years a go, but even Governor Michael Leavitt was interfering. Leavitt used Sorenson to cover the Cheri Taylor girl, one of my run aways and screwed that up!

    Now that Warren has proved our fears 11 years later, I think some ones head should roll, how many young girls could of avoided the life now in question?

    Deseret News tonight blocked my comments, though the Trib lifted my life time ban on the Brooke Adams blog. Trib said they knew nothing of it, but it was in an email that I had been banned for life for using rule names and showing real emails from government agencies.

    Am I wrong to want my pound of political flesh?


  199. Anonymous said this on August 2, 2011 at 10:53 PM

    i didn’t repeat your post because…

    You misunderstood, it meant that they wanted WJ to keep HIS hands above the table.

    just my opinion

  200. Hi Jay! big fan here! Glad you are elated.

  201. hi Jay! Glad after all these years, this is all coming out in the light

  202. On a totally shallow note, Nick Hanna reading Warren’s dictations sounds so much better than Warren. He’s not bad on the eyes either.

  203. This is just surreal. Its bigger than I ever expected, thanks to Whackadoodle Warren and his traveling Circus.

    I pity the children involved. The Desperate Snooze had an article posting these:

    “He promises they will feel the all-consuming fire of heaven, and by giving comfort to their husband, they will be touching God.”

    ( pssst thats not the all consuming fire of heaven Warren! )

    “On the recording, there are many long minutes in which it’s hard to make out exactly what’s happening. But it seems to include sounds of fumbling with clothing, sobbing, flushing of toilets.”

    ( My word he has them crying and barfing – buck up children! )

  204. Enuff with the Nick ‘hubba-hubba’ Hana reports. Jay good to see your post here, I thik i’ve been mistaken the most for being you, FLDS and abbettors, think we are one-and-the-same, really funny.

    Do you have a take on these YFZ Temple celestial training? Do you think they are ‘Warrenite’ or go back-in-the-day to Jos. Smith, Jr. or Brigham Young?

  205. I didn’t expect to be this shocked. Maybe Willie’s not full of #%$& when he says they had not idea….

  206. Jay

    Good to see you!

    Yes indeed its good that Texas is finally taking out this trash, its a tragedy UT ever let Warren go so far, and yes heads should roll.

    Shurtleff wont run again ( partly also due to his failures with Jeremy Johnson et al )

    Leavitt is out of the picture,

    Jon Huntsman and Mitt Romney cant get this monkey off their back,

    and the mainstream LD$ MOrg is splattered with Jeffs mud.

    OH Word

    Lindberg ruled the STATE of UTAH has to pay Wisan and his attorneys, and then the STATE will have to collect from the UEP.

    I am glad for Bruce, and associates… It was the right thing to do since the legal process to take care of business in the crick was hogtied by this MORG machine.

  207. NOTWITHSTANDING THE FACT that warren j. is a pervert pedofile:

    In support of certain law enforcement agencies:
    The problem that law enforcement has with people like flora mae is that she is around forty-two years old and hasn’t lived in the community since she was sixteen. She takes isolated incidences that have occurred or are rumored to have occurred in individual lives throughout a hundred years and she reports them to be systemic abuses that are daily occurrences. So when law enforcement rushes in to investigate, they find little or nothing to go on. I think that any further allegations by flora should come with proof. She has gotten away with her slander for far too long. I can’t believe that some of the agencies that she has “helped” (they will no longer associate with her) have not stepped forward and alerted Dr. Drew and others of the hazards of relying soley on her reports without corroborating evidence. Even carolyn just sat there and listened to her lies without saying anything. Birds of a feather??

    I have to change the channel whenever they interview her. She is doing more harm to the “victims” than good, IMO.

  208. I hope Texas does what most of us expect, but either way, a heavy truth from Warren’s own mouth, nerifies what many of us had said over this past decade.

    Still Snow & Nuffer defended Colorado City and interfered when Oleh Rumak a Canadian TV Producer was in his 3rd installment YOU CAN NEVER LEAVE, THE BISHOP OF BOUNTIFUL, etc. Nuffer shifted from City Attorney to defending the FLDS way of life. Later Governor Leavitt would reward Nuffer with a judgeship in Utah. Nuffer was the Utah Bar Association President in Utah in 2000 & 2001. Nuffers partner Steven Snow, General Authority of the LDS church. Snow & Nuffer both former Deputy County Attorneys. Then Nuffer was Ron Thompson’s old legal partner, Thompson Hildale’s city attorney and Special council since 1981. Thompson was the District attorney elected in Washington County Utah in 1973-1978, he knew the law. Durring the years in question Thompson was the 5th District Bar Association President and knew ALL the local judges. When Utah created SUPAC a economic development commision it was made up of Orrin Hatch, Michael Leavitt & Ronald Williard Thompson. When Orrin Hatch defended the FLDS in a March 2003 Town Hall meeting, that ended with a written letter from his attorney trying to distance himself from his own public comments. His own field deputy in an interview spoke of Senator Hatch playing the organ in the Leroy Johnson meeting hall, she is Jannine Holt!

    Mike Leavitts father Dixie Leavitt was the key note speaker at graduation in Colorado City in 1987, Rulon Jeffs & Uncle Fred Jessop and Fred’s brother Rich were close to Dixie Leavitt. When you piece together the power players that interfered for the FLDS, they were the most powerful men in Utah. While Washinton County DA Eric Ludlow was called on the carpet in 2003 for no polygamy cases or prosecutions in his 13 years of service, he was no more than a lacky for the bigger political players. Ludow after several excuses and a few lies was granted his judgeship, also at the hands of former governor Leavitt.

    There needs to be an accounting for WHO KNEW WHAT & WHEN DID THEY KNOW IT? How many lives of children could of been spared the pain? Elissa Wall was 2001, along with Cheri Taylor, Ruth Stubbs, Caroline Cooke and several others, taken to that Caliente HOT SPRINGS Resort in Nevada for more illegal unions. The loyalty was to the old guys, not Warren, but once in control, how could they distance themselves from Warren who was way more extreme!

    Then of course there are many independent fundamentalist, who is taking note of these?

  209. If the prosecution rests, tomorrow or Thursday [depending on the time outs for the screaming profit], I wonder if Warren will call any witnesses. If he is just going to parade a group of people who have done business with him, saying what a GREAT guy he is, then it’s another time waster. At this point, if they’ve been reading the papers and the seeing the stuff on TV, maybe they’ll bail on him! It’ll be interesting, to say the least!
    Even TV writer’s can’t make tbhis %$#@! up! But, you can probably bet that a storyline for one of the detective shows, is probably being formulated, as we speak!

  210. the parade of people patting on the back doesn’t come until the penalty phase and since he hasn’t worked in the community, he doesn’t have any “good ole boys” to say he’s special.

    I cant think of anyone, except maybe his wives, who he could call to testify. Bubba Lyle is here along with JD Roundy. Thugly is also in the courtroom. That could be interesting. Or, maybe Mad Bill will come help him out.

  211. CAJim, don’t be trashing Nick. I think if he’d been the one giving revelations from the almighty, I might be convinced to convert.

    Warrens voice is so tinny and monotone. Nick has a booming voice like you would expect from someone people follow to their own detriment.

  212. Today on one of the shows Kathy Jo was talking about her brother Johnnies death. The lady on the show said that they had contacted the LE in that area and asked for a copy of the report. They never got back to the news station.

    Kathy Jo also said that the FBI had looked into it but I can’t remember what she said they found out.

    I remember that there was something really odd about it all.

  213. I’m going to bed, stuck in rural Oregon, or else I’d be at trial. Thank you to everyone who is keeping us apprised. And, or course, Fred.

  214. In the next life the persons here who committed acts that damaged or destroyed anyone’s faith are going to face major spiritual consequences. I can’t think of any one act that would likely elicit one of the harshest judgments. Being a ‘false prophet’ is one hard case but to have destroyed/damaged someone’s faith or beliefs would hold a dire recompense. The four sins that cryout and are heard in heaven of murder, oppression of a widow, child or foreigner, slavery or denying a workman his daily wage seems as sinful as to have caused anyone to lose their faith or ability to believe.

  215. The Mudwacky person was posting in the forums under the name WilliesFriend. Most of his posts have been removed, and he either shut up or they banned him.

    I didn’t realize he was a big Tony Alamo supporter too.

  216. Also, on his Facebook page, Mudwacky says his “Mormon friends” asked him to post a link to his blog.

    He also claims that Warren is “following his advice” by not participating in the “dog and pony show.” And he says the case will go to the Supreme Court.

    What a complete buffoon.

  217. No matter what name he tries to hide under, Mudwacky’s writing style, and apologist content, usually gives him away. He is one major wingnut!

  218. I have posted under fincenMIB, Obstructionist, CEO, InTruthandLight, AvengingAngel, and several dozen other alias’s. I have battled myself on the SLC Trib Blog, used President Monsons former name sake and a few others.

    The FLDS threatened me in writing in March 2001, it was Rod Parker after I had dialoged with Truman Barlow regarding UEP taxes. I paid Lenore Holms taxes and they were rejected. I filed intimidation complaints against Parker under US Code title 18, section 1512. A felony because I had already gone to the County, state & FBI as a witness and informant.

    P,O.S.T. complaints were filed in October & November of 2000 with Garrett in Arizona (DPS) Deardon in Utah. Robert Flowers replaced Deardon as the head of DPS in Utah and was not one of my favorite Cops, he had been the Chief of Police in St. George Utah and knew the full history of Colorado City. He got a detailed letter that explained it ALL, but blew it off in writing. The FBI sent me a 3 pages trashing me letter 18 months before putting Warren Jeffs on their MOST WANTED List, I gave it to the press and it was published world wide out of New Zealand! Flowers sat on the same County Gang Task Force with me, my roots out of Los Angeles (Gangs & Graffiti). I worked with Kirk Smith in 1993 to get him elected as Sheriff against Glennwood Humphrey my Hurricane UT neighbor, I put him on KSL TV, then fought bitterly with him when he returned Caroline Cooke to her father Marvin in April 2001. In front of a St. George Utah Spectrum Reporter Smith had chosen to return Caroline after informing him that Marvin was under investigation for INCEST in West Valley UT where he had married his step daughter Afton, his second wife (Roberta Mackerts) daughter. Caroline the runaway was the first wifes daughter, first wife was Julie Darger!

    The problem in Utah was the state was not aggressive and hired investigators who only had a limited knowledge. Mike King under AG Jan Grahm, Ron Barton when Mark Shurtleff came in. Jim Hill later on and some of us remember Shurtleffs Communications man Paul Murphy when he was first a TV anchor covering the same polygamy stories. In Arizona I worked with Burke, Suzie Ellis, Ron Gibson, Meg or Margaret Pollard, Jane Irvine, Lee R. and on an on that list goes, the AZ crowd started with Janet Napolitano. I can tell you when Shurtleff was elected I was dealing with Amy Isom of his campaign staff and troy with his 2001 transition team, but he did little for us until 2002 when he assigned Kristine Knowlton as a day to day contact. I have over 1,000 emails to and from both the Utah & Arizona Attorney Generals staff. You can hear Lisa Morriison of Napolitano’s staff on my YouTube channel.

    Thomas Russell of DEA, Steve Fillerup, Gail Gneckow and Jim Goins of the Utah FBI. Hey I graduated from a federal law enforcement academy myself in 1983, it was Santa Rosa CJC So recorded and documenting calls to government agencies seemed like a smart thing to do.

    But now with Warren proving my point, 11 years later and a lot of victims later, guys like Sheriff Smith deserve no retirement benefits, they obstructed justice and ignored victims. Thanks to Warren the world will hear what Janet Napolitano ignored, she was the worst! In the 2002 Arizona election Janet was doing radio shows and my name had to be changed to call in and even then I got cut off when the questions revealed the source. That election was Matt Salmon, Richard Mahoney & J Napolitano.

    I left Utah for several reasons, few to do with the FLDS directly, it was other government agencies worth fearing! An accounting is due!!!

  219. Kathy Jo’s brother was a near expert climber and fell to his death. He was out spoken against the religious leaders and she feared his ropes had been tampered with. I met kathy at the 2008 polygamy summit in St. George, UT Local Law Enforcement was Kirk Smith on the Utah side. I doubt he would go beyond questioning the Colorado City or Hildale Police, he at that time had a working relationship with Sam Roundy Jr the CC Chief and Sam Barlow before that. I hear Sam is rotting in Hell! Couldn’t happen to a better henchman of the FLDS.

    Kathy questioned whether a rope was cut, but we will never know without that evidence. While “Blood Atonement” was preached and used as a threat, it is still unclear to me whether any case has been drawn to it. There have been deaths, most explained, but from those inside!

  220. Bill “madman” Whacky, Hughe McBride was it? Thotman on the Trib blog threatened to publish my home and cell phone over his defense of the FLDS. Its hard to hear and see or believe Willie rejecting Warren. The video is amazing, but short of the penalties of following a FALSE PROPHET.

  221. Crazy Ruth in the documentary was Ruth Cooke one of Jack’s daughters. I got to know Jack when I still lived in Utah. He admitted sex with his 15 year old daughter, insisting she made choices as an adult woman. He was scetchy about the 13 year old daughter and in confessing did 5 years in prison for whatever occured. I have my black mail photo’s of crazy Ruth with Mohave County Supervisor Buster Johnson, I think that was the March 2005 polygamy conference! The truth beknown I got involved in the inviting process when we were not sure we could fill the conference center. I secured and invited Winston Blackmore and from that used him coming to stimulate a full house. Homeland Security & the AG met with him trying to get the goods on Warren, but Winston was expert at playing both ends. Both AG’s attended, making the event VERY HIGH security.

    The tapes of Warren, he was insane at making audio’s he started that at the Alta Academy. I had 550 of the audios from 1995 to 2002, sending 3 to Brock Belnap in the 2007 trial. I had donated 100 to HOPE Organization in St. George, but did so by dropping them off with Gary E. at the trailer in Colorado City, so interesting, it took Gary and the Mohave County DA almost a year to forward them to HOPE! Brock didn’t have the time to listen to 100 audios and wanted the instructions to the young girls and the phrases about treating the boys as SNAKES. Shamefully I had listened to most of the 550 and knew which ones to copy and send!

    I once had 14 of the FLDS hardbacks, but lost most to Krakauer when he wrote his book. He forwarded these to Hoole, Elissa’s attorney. I got down to 2 books, PURITY and “In Light & Truth”, but in 2008 the Texas prosecution through channels requested my copy of IN LIGHT AND TRUTH. I haven’t seen that copy since, but couldn’t help myself when I saw another copy on ebay. I bought it and 2 other hardbacks. I still favor “Purity In the New and Everlasting Covenant of Marriage” its smaller and just as concise. My copy was used in Carolyn Jessops 2002 court case. Mike Walkiss borrowed it at the 2008 summit, but I am fortunate to still have it. Fighting the FLDS attorneys was no longer an issue, once I had enough audios and text. I also collected deposition like that of Rulon Jeffs from 1989. Knowledge was power and I could go head to head, as long as I had info the FLDS feared I could make public. I still have 375-400 of the Jeffs audios.

    Being an audio nut Warren used the old Mormon discourses, but generated many of his own as well. I think he proved himself human, obsessing with more and younger sex, if we believe Brent Jeffs with young boys as well. Not really that unusual if you look at Sex Crimes, In was P.O.S.T. Certified in 1983 in to Sex Crimes Investigations and Warren all powerful was consumed by desire and a power to have any thing or one he desired. Not to far from the history of Joseph Smith if you are a historian, the partridge sisters, Sarah Kimball shy of her 15th Birthday etc. As I recall, I think I agreed with Krakauer on Joseph Smith having 47 wives according to church records, including his first wife Emma.

    Absolute power, is absolute corrupting! If no social norms stopped any man, how many women would be enough for the most powerful man? Warren has what 80-100 do we really know? Winston Blackmore had 26 or 27 counting his first wife Jane, before Warren began demanding that some leave him. First its 3 connected wifes, then 7, then its as many as you can get. Often the “pure seed” doctrine follows! Look at Joe Knudson in Centennial Park, did he stop at just 7?

  222. Ron W. Thompson

    Mr. Thompson is a member of the Utah State Bar. He graduated from Brigham Young University in 1971 with a degree in accounting and received his law degree from the University of Utah in 1974. Mr. Thompson served as Washington County attorney from 1973-1978. He previously served on the Board of Directors of the Statewide Association of Prosecutors, the Utah Association of Counties, and the Utah Association of Special Districts.

    From the SPECTRUM 2003;
    Thompson and Urquhart are partners at the law firm Thompson Awerkamp Urquhart, which has represented the city of Hildale for more than 20 years. Urquhart said he had handled municipal works for Hildale, but has dropped it since January to concentrate on his duties at the Legislature. In March, he voted for the child bigamy bill.

    Thompson, however, said he is still willing to assist Hildale with municipal works.

    “Religion has nothing to do with how they operate,” he said. “The people have always been polite, their kids well disciplined.”

    Other than the practice of marrying child brides, Thompson added, he doesn’t oppose the polygamists’ “personal beliefs.”

    “They respect what I believe,” he said. “I respect what they believe.”


  223. Jay thank you for all your detailed posting. I’ll come back and read it all – I promise.

    I’ve been mulling all that happened today over in my mind.

    Judge Walther and the Texas Rangers – along with Sheriff Doran and others deserve a medal. They had those children out of that hell hole. What exquisite judgement they showed.

    Another thing I was thinking about was Natalie Malonis and how she fought for Warren’s daughter. You can’t convince me that he treated her any better than the rest of the women and children.

    I hereby award all the Miele medal of courage and excellence.

    Over and out.

  224. “okay, I had heard rumors of lesbian acts and group sex, but to see it in open court with audio proof is truly sickening. Here is a question:
    Did Warren learn this behavior from his dad? if not, who? – as per Long Time Gone …

    People do not exhibit these kind of behaviors unless they have learned them somewhere. I am wondering where he learned these behaviors as well.

  225. Howdy folks

    I am extremely interested in the current trial of Warren Jeffs. I don’t know why; I live in Australia where we have our own quota of sickos, creepsters and loonies but nothing as spectacular as this flds bunch.

    As all you folks here seem to know lots about the FLDS I want to ask you a question.

    I’ve recently read three books: “Under the Banner of Heaven”, “Escape” and “Church of LIes”. If I am to believe these accounts (and I do) many people in various positions of authority (e.g. cops, judges, mayors) in Utah and Arizona have protected these pedophiles for many a year because lots of them were/are in the sect. I am curious to know whether or not these people have been entirely weeded out yet, or not? Or is it business as usual in the twin cities?

  226. Magic Undies, as of this exact moment, it is still business as usual.

    At the national levelHowever rumor has it that the FBI is involved in a number of investigations over federal offenses related to email hacking; civil rights abuses, and there is still the unknown federal grand jury from Texas.

    At the Arizona state level there is an ongoing investigation of fraud with respect to money from the fire department.

    At the local level there are a number of lawsuits from recently ex’d members who are claiming fraud against Jeffs’ brother Lyle for conspiring to keep from the members the knowledge that Jeffs’ claimed he was not the prophet and asking for custody of their children as they are in imminent danger.

    the biggest possible good news (unless the FBI steps up to the plate) would be resolution of the United Effort Plan issue. Right now that ball has been punted from Lindberg (definitely a white hat in the Utah system) court to local federal court where it was back to good old boy FLDS cronies, but then the next level up in the fed system in Denver stepped in which is good because they are out of the snake pit. The issue is getting the power away from the FLDS leaders where teh power is to kick people out of homes, by putting those homes into the individual hands of the members.

    Last and not least is the Canadian “Supreme Court” test case on the illegality of polygamy and the final crack down of the national government there on tax shenanigans by the FLDS in Bountiful, Alberta.

  227. Jay,
    I agree entirely, heads should roll, but sadly I don’t think they will.

  228. All,
    I must be pretty naive because never did I consider the full depravity of Warren Jeffs.
    I read alot of trash novel thrillers, and I also write and construct plot lines, but this is beyond my imagination.

    Thanks to all of you for being a great source of education on this material….

  229. AP reports that the Utah Commerce will recognize Jeffs as president of FLDS today barring any additional information…..

    speechless – can a felon be president? can’t they figure out a way to wait until he is convicted…. unless….. they don’t want to wait?

  230. Thanks for the info hellohellogoodbye. You’re all getting up out of bed to have your Wednesday. I am headed bed-wards – it’s 10:17pm Wednesday here.

    cheers & good night

  231. LE and politicians cant beg ignorance.

    Jay was ringing their bell, and they let this bullcrap roll right along.

    I expect there will be a lot of heartburn on the State and Federal level.

    And those guys from Utah running for President – hope they have lots of money to burn.

    People dont excuse child molesters like they might have years ago.

    So many people had a hand in helping this Jeffs bozo abuse all these people and children.

  232. Woke up at five thiry my time…after sleeping fitfully for four hours. I only could dream about the Jeffs trial…..and I’m the kinda person who doesn’t even crack open an eye until after ten in the morning.

    The verdict couldn’t come quickly enough….

    My fiance, (exFLDS) says his defense will most likely be to get up and preach and preach and preach until he is stopped. I tend to agree, I think the prosecution got under his skin enough to aggrivate him into blowing a gasket.

    Since his attorneys got fired, will those three defense witness still come up and testify? Or is that motion void now?

  233. Instead of writing that WARNING to Obama, the NATION and EARTH

    and oh yeah the JUDGE

    He should have WARNED his SHEEPLE and those enablers in UTARDY

    That he was going to embarrass the lot of them and make them look like fools.

  234. Ariel

    Warren will have his opportunity to put up a defense – this is likely where he will have the opportunity to preach a sermon.

    We already know what he is going to say, they will be the same words just mixed up a bit.

    He has nothing for a defense – he would have saved himself a lot of grief, and his protectors back home, if he had plead guilty and kept this stuff locked up.

    OOPS the evidence is now out, the horse is out of the barn as they say…

  235. I for one, am glad he didn’t just plead guilty and sweep it all under a rug. The Texas trial continues the shed more light on the cult than Utah has done in twenty years!

    And to see the way this trial has helped my Barlow beau heal is a wonderful thing to witness. I hope others get the same experience!

    I admit tho, I’ve got a massive crush on Nick Hanna….mostly because he took the stand for ten whole hours. Must have been exuasting…..

  236. Did yall here on In Session this morning that Willie Jessop was in the courtroom yesterday,, and stayed through the whole thing,,, Lyle Jeffs has been there every day,, but when the documents are read,, he leaves the courtroom,, and when the tapes were played, he left the courtroom

  237. They said the jury was looking down,, many with their hands over their faces,, even the men. Evidently this t ape was sickening

  238. I have to say that I probably owe Willie an apology…. I assumed he would stick to Jeffs forever simply for the money and power etc…. I thought his “morally indefensible” statement was a power play for Timpson and not for real…

  239. I can’t wait to see Warren Jeff’s defense. Wonder how lawyer Ken Driggs and the apologist religious scholar intend to defend Warren Jeffs….

  240. I’m betting Lyle was told that the tapes and documents are “sacred” and he isn’t worthy to witness them. When it reality it’s damming evidence.

    Wonder if he even has a clue of their nature. Actually, he probably does.

    DD1, why did they put their hands over their faces? If I were sickened and disgusted by Warren, I would glare the hair right off of said sick and disgusting prevert. Is it so they don’t appear biased? If they do appear biased, could it be grounds for a mistrial?

  241. Four minutes and counting til trial continues. Twitter pages are up and ready to be scoured for updates.

  242. florajessop Flora Jessop
    Mothers are the ones who take their child by the hand and place it in the hand of the older man during the marriage ceremony.

    This was posted about a half hour ago.

    Oh contrair Flora….and I hate to disagree with you….But nowadays, most of the time the parents aren’t there. And if there is a parent, it’ll be the father usually.

    Not saying there aren’t exceptions, but it is not the norm. Maybe it was a whole three pophets ago when you were in the cult. Back when Leroy was presiding.

    All the best Ms. Jessop, keep tweeting.

  243. Guess after the tape and the prosecution rests, it’ll be Warren’s turn to mount a “morally indefensible defense”….

    And yeah, it leaves all the polygamy apologists with egg on their faces.

    This is the end result, of what polygamy and its abuses can come to.

    Canada hasnt ruled on legalizing polygamy, they are pondering, and they must be watching.

    Yeah, Canada, this is what you get.

  244. Ariel,, because my understanding was the tape was sickening, and there were a couple of jurors that glared at warren during the tapes. There were more details in the tapes,, that are coming out today,,

  245. In Session reporters who were in the courtroom, said you could hear young girls whimpering in the background of this particular tape

  246. Warren is going to have a hard time living this down.

    Does he really think he is going to keep these details secret from the Sheeples?

    He is going down like Hitler.

  247. Lyle Jeffs leaving the Courtroom seems to be a ludicrous act for a Bishop of Short Creek to be enacting some supposed, ‘Hear no evil, see no evil and speak no evil” monkey defense.

    Does Lyle not really know the ‘Emperor has no clothes’ or is he another FLDS Church fanatic that honestly hasn’t been told about the ‘Heavenly Sessions’, like Willie R. “Thug’ Jessop.

    Seems preposterous to me that group celestial sex training was being practiced at the YFZ Temple and Lyle Jeffs, as a sect Elder, wouldn’t know about it’s practices and purposes. Speaking of Willie R. Jessop is he going to get around to apologizing or ever owning up to his mistaken comments that attacked the Press & Public for persecuting his beloved FLDS Church?

  248. Girls heard whimpering in the tape?

    Well, I hardly thought the children would be chasing him down the street.

    Its Warren’s turn to whimper now.

  249. Well the FLDS Church apologists had conviced themselves that this was singularly and solely a US Constitutional fight over ‘Due Process’ and improper search warrant execution(s). They termed the YFZ incusion as a.”Fishing Expedition” or “Witch Hunt”, don’t look now boyz ‘cuz we have a stringer of fish and Broom Hilda is holding it up to take pictures. Then because the search warrants were claimed to be improperly gotten, we were not to review the seized evidence, like pictures, dictations, records or audio tapes. Then the endless arguing in defense of such criminal group behaviors under the guise of future Court Appeals and persecution of the poor fundies being persecuted. Warren’s own words condemn his activites as being against the law, criminal and the need to keep a,”Heavenly Hush”. Warren’s comments about the need to keep the ‘Lands of Refuge” sacred and secret in order to grow them bigger before the neighbor’s find out the gulags exist, clearly a covert plan and hidden agenda.

  250. Those poor poor girls.

    And I know I’m just droning on and on because I’m ancy….But I’m a little taken aback that there was whimpering on the tape. All we ever hear is “it’s such an honor to marry the prophet, all the girls hope dearly for it” and every variation of these girls wern’t forced, they loved it, blah blah.

    Now, I don’t believe that for a minute, but I was kind of expecting for them to just shut up and not voice there concerns, keep sweet and “come close quickly” because that’s what they’re taught to do.

    But believe you me, I’m so glad they couldn’t live up to their trianing (no amount of words will prepare you to get raped by a 48-50 year old man.) and because of that, justice will be done.

    Maybe that last paragraph sounded harsh, but I mean no disrespect. My heart goes out to these girls.

    I wonder if that girl who was recently interviewed in the creek saying Jeffs meant “everything” to her would still hold him in the same esteem if she heard the tapes. But maybe she’d think it was a fake….or those whimpering girls just weren’t accepting their blessings.

  251. Warren’s sex life, although shocking to read about, is not surprising to me. He admitted at one point from his jail cell having “touched” his sister. I assumed that was when he was younger. After that I assumed he would try most anything at least once. Too sad he damaged many little girls in the process. And yes, something needs to be done to get help for them.

    But, my take is that this type of deviant behavior is because they themselves saw this behavior, or were abused themselves, or it just may come “naturally” to some. Sex in heaven is part of mormonism – and not mainstream. One downside of polygamy is low access to one’s own husband – so not surprising some of the woman may seek after a sister wife.

    – brings new meaning to phrase – “keeping it in the family.”

  252. And if they are wrapping up today – then what ever happened with the witness list of all of his wives? Did they change their minds?

  253. The Warren Jeffs Trial
    Dispatches from the Warren Jeffs trial in San Angelo
    by Katy Vine

    August 2011

    Sects With Strangers (November 2004) »
    Editor’s Note: Senior Editor Katy Vine, who wrote about the YFZ Ranch in 2009, is in San Angelo reporting on the Warren Jeffs trial. Read her regularly updated dispatches here, and follow her on Twitter @katy_vine.

    August 1, 2011
    Boy, proceedings sure move along when the defendant decides not to cross-examine the witnesses. Friday afternoon I thought this trial might take a month; now I’m wondering if I’ll be checking out of my hotel by the end of the week.

    Warren Jeffs’ standby counsel, Deric Walpole, was in the courtroom the whole day but so far the judge hasn’t asked him to take over. I’ve been told that if Jeffs’ outbursts become too disruptive, she can order Walpole back in the driver’s seat, at which point he could choose to recall all the witnesses: law enforcement officials saying again that yes indeed, they did secure that evidence, or take that DNA, and yes it remained in custody. I’m sure everybody realizes this is important, but at one point I saw someone in court actually fall asleep (not a juror).

    Still, the day had its dramatic moments. Straight out of the gate, Warren Jeffs produced his third motion to recuse the judge, a motion he was denied. The paperwork was clearly written by him with only a little legal assistance. (I don’t think a lawyer would write “I am now to recuse you from this case.”) The three-and-a-half page single-spaced motion, based on the “Revelation of the Lord Given to President Warren S. Jeffs,” outlined the now-familiar argument that she is persecuting him. An affidavit added that she should “be of a humbling to know I have sent a crippling disease upon her which shall take her life soon.” Adding insult to injury, he misspelled Walther’s name twice as “Walthers.” (He’s not the only one with the problem; my twitter account keeps trying to change her name to “waltzer.”)

    Most surprising, perhaps, was how little Jeffs objected during the day’s final testimony, from Rebecca Musser. She spent maybe two and a half hours going over her former role in the church—she was married to Warren’s father, Rulon, when Rulon was the prophet­—and the importance of family documents in the FLDS. I thought her testimony would have prompted a series of objections since she was talking in detail about the FLDS teachings, but Jeffs just sat at his table, staring straight ahead. Near the end of the day, at about 7:30, the prosecutor introduced photographs of Warren Jeffs and the two victims. One photo showed Jeffs kissing a small girl on the mouth, an image that will probably stay in the jury’s mind for a long time. Jeffs remained silent.

    Since the prosecution seems relatively close to wrapping up, I’m wondering if the temple table will be introduced as evidence. So far it hasn’t been mentioned, but it sure sounds like it would be related to one or both of these cases. The temple document states: “There is a table, but it will be made so it can be a table or it can be a bed. It should be made so the table top can come off. It will be on wheels. It will have a bench that you kneel on that is cushioned and upholstered. When the mattress is in place, this bench will be to the right side of the bed. This will be made so that it can be taken apart and stored in a closet where no one can see it. When I need it, I will pull it out and set it up. It will be made of hardwood that is very strong and that does not rattle when it is shaken…The bed will be a size big enough for me to lay on…It will be covered with a sheet, but it will have a plastic cover to protect the mattress from what will happen on it…the bed will be seven feet long, the table will be nine feet long…and the bed will need some padded sides that can be pulled up that will hold me in place as the Lord does his work with me. At times the table will be out of that room as well as the bed. It must be made so we can push it out and just have chairs in a circle in there. And then at times, the table will be set in place.”

  254. This is texas monthly article today

  255. Don’t forget the incident at Alta Academy either….

    “Brent Jeffs, Warren’s nephew alleges that when he was five or six years old, that Jeffs and two other uncles repeatedly sexually abused him in a bathroom at the school. Brent Jeffs was backed by his father, also alleges the men abused two of his brothers; one brother committed suicide in 2001.”


    Thanks admin for putting it on the blogroll!

    If Warren is convicted on the sexual assault charges, will Texas continue to try him for bigamy this Oct? Or will they pull an Arizona and drop the charges since they’ve already fried him and to save money?

  256. So being called to the ‘Zion Mission’ at the YFZ Raunch and being termed a ‘Templebuilder’ has a whole new meaning this morning. The ‘Lands of Refuge’ are indoctrination camps and FLDS Church training gulags for preparing ‘Child Brides’ for the future needs of the Prophet, Priesthood and the FLDS Church. Do we recall the open house at the YFZ Raunch for the Press & Public to be assured that no wrong doing existed at their raunchland; no teen wedlocks, no pregnant or minor mothers. Big tears, complete denials and pleas to end their persecutions. Then a series of guilty verdicts ensued and yesterday the deep dark sacred and secret pratices at the YFZ Temple were brought to light. Now the Press & Public open house comes back to haunt them, displaying the 100% participation in lies and complete attempt to pull the wool over the Nations access to the truth, truly amazing and previously attested to by many apostates. You recall the apostate whores, liars, and money grubbing authors that are just in this to get even and make a buck. How many of those FLDS plural wives that were interviewed lied, participated in the Temple celestial training and claimed that no minors were celestially sealed and bedded.

  257. gosanangelo
    #Warrenjeffs began today w yet another request for continuance. Judge denies. Prosecution submitting final evidence – no tape yet.
    24 minutes ago

  258. gosanangelo
    #Warrenjeffs has objected 2X so far. Prosecution notes that he has softened his objection language from staunch denial to ‘supposedly.’
    24 minutes ago

  259. Warren not expected to call any defense witnesses

    “Jeffs, who is representing himself and claims that God will seek revenge if the trial continues, says his rights to religious freedom are being trampled. He is defending himself but gave no opening statement, hasn’t cross-examined any state witnesses and isn’t expected to call witnesses in his defense.”

  260. CAJim didn’t Mr. Walsh say during the Texas Raid trials that the Temple bed was used for those that become “faint” or tired during the long sessions during ceremonies held in the Temples.

    Didn’t Mr. Walsh also say that this Temple design is similar to the design used in the LDS Church?

    Does anyone have access to the trial minutes during this time? Was it posted at gosanangelo?

    Wasn’t there some issues concerning such topics years ago based on this very thing. Memos sent were posted on line and they talked about people being naked, sex acts, rituals etc. What ever came of that?

    History holds many stories.

  261. There has been a confusion about the Temple beds. As I recall there was a ground floor backroom that contained a regular bed and Willie R. Jessop discussed it with Oprah Winfrey. Then there is the white coronation bed with upholsterd kneeler and mini-observation stair-stepped platform that has been the focus of much speculation and puzzling speculations. I think we are now focused on the white enthroned bed and it intended purposes and actual uses within the 3rd floor YFZ Temple. “Heavenly Sessions” has taken on a new revelation in meaning and the stair-stepped platform was for viewing purposes? Let’s hope the prosecution can explain more on these speculations.

  262. “Jeffs, who is representing himself and claims that God will seek revenge if the trial continues, says his rights to religious freedom are being trampled. He is defending himself but gave no opening statement, hasn’t cross-examined any state witnesses and isn’t expected to call witnesses in his defense.”


    God is getting his revenge all right . . . against Warren!

  263. In the early 90’s there was a lot of talk going around. And of course some things must be taken with a grain of salt to many things said. But this is just one article that has information I find interesting. But please read the whole article.

    An overwhelming majority of Utahns – 90 percent – believe in the existence of satanic or ritualistic abuse of children, even the sacrifice of babies, a Deseret News/KSL-TV poll shows.

  264. For many years people have often brought up the “Tanners” when ever I would ask certain questions. Which always makes me curious as to what is really behind the story or stories.

    Utah is considered to be highly populated with those of the LDS faith. With 90 percent of the people believing that Satanic rituals take place doesn’t that say something?

  265. Gosanangelo has been tweeting every few minutes. I’m not going to get anything done today.

    Warren still objecting, Judge still over ruling, jury looks bored with his mini-sermons. Birth certificate of 15-year old presented as evidence.

  266. The “ick factor” about the bed: Warren requesting a rubber sheet to protect it against “the things” that will take place on it.

    This very much reminds me of Satanic rituals you see depicted in movies and literature, in which the altar is used as a platform for rape, with an audience of the faithful gathered around to watch.

  267. It will surely be a movie one day!

  268. I think the attacks against Flora Jessop are unfair. I don’t disagree with the specifics:

    “She takes isolated incidences that have occurred or are rumored to have occurred in individual lives throughout a hundred years and she reports them to be systemic abuses that are daily occurrences. So when law enforcement rushes in to investigate, they find little or nothing to go on.”

    I’ve noticed that too. I will read a first hand account from an insider and then hear Flora make an inflammatory accusation that exaggerates or overstates the claims in first-hand account.

    But here is the thing: She is not a trained journalist or investigator. Yes, someone who is making serious accusations should get her facts straight, but she is in the role because no one with real training was willing to get involved. (Ok, that’s an overstatement. There are a few good, hardworking people – but not nearly enough. I can only imagine what it must take to keep talking into the wind.)

    If she goes after this in an unsophisticated manner, acting on emotion, making assumptions and un-collaborated claims – at least she is out there. A lot of what she has been saying has been demonstrated to be true. If she doesn’t live up to our expectations for journalistic integrity, perhaps someone would like to point out the legions of trained investigative reporters lining up to take her place.

  269. If the mother was in Texas then so was her up close and personal sperm donor.

  270. Well if Satan is the deceiver, liar and twister of the truth then this Temple ritual/practice seems to fit the bill for me. The need for secrecy, the wickedness of following a crooked path and the grossness of group sexual expression being enacted at the behest of one male’s gratification. This violates several laws, given that these women are not legally wed to Warren, and the fact that a minor girl/girls were present and participating snarls the total on how many felonies were committed. This is Warren’s view of a ‘Holy Way’, this is the FLDS Church’s sacrosanct revelation and this is why ‘sacred and secreted’ places of refuge need to be created in Eldorado, Texas, Pringle, South Dakota and Mancos, Colorado? Does everyone realize that the plural marriage practice is merely the first felony and then the felonies of sex trafficking, sexual assault, celestial training, illegitimate children, falsified medical records, unreported child births, re-assignments of families, etc. Yes, the first act of plural marriage is just the tip of a fundamentalist ‘iceberg’ ofsubsequent crimes that will follow to preserve the first crime of bigamy from being exposed or arrests made, this then sets up the covert crime wave.

  271. I am tired of reading personal attacks made against Flora Jessop – Flora haters, please write your diatribes elsewhere. Most people would walk away because it is not worth the trouble – at least she has the courage to continue to fight.

  272. Flora Jessop stands today more vindicated that ever in the past 5 years, she is one ot the true heroines in thia saga. Standing for truth, justice and respect for our judicial system is Flora’s focus. She has called for the mother’s to be held to account for these abises of young sex trafficked daughters and I believe that she is totally right, half-measures employed in Utah and Arizona have produced this polygynist crime wave. Warren Jeffs states that his sequestered gulags need to be ‘sacred and secret’. Do watchtowers, locked and fenced enclaves and hundreds of women and children held captives on these placesw of refuge suggest that this ‘Holy Way’ or “The Work” needs to be preserved or ended?

  273. This can’t be said enough:

    CAJim: “Does everyone realize that the plural marriage practice is merely the first felony and then the felonies of sex trafficking, sexual assault, celestial training, illegitimate children, falsified medical records, unreported child births, re-assignments of families, etc. Yes, the first act of plural marriage is just the tip of a fundamentalist ‘iceberg’ ofsubsequent crimes that will follow to preserve the first crime of bigamy from being exposed or arrests made, this then sets up the covert crime wave.”


    In a closed society that practices polygyny and preaches that a man needs at least three wives to get into heaven, do the math: they can’t exist for more than two generations without resorting to immoral and/or criminal activities.

  274. This was on the tape heard last night,

    You have to know how to be sexually excited,” Jeffs said in the recording. “Everyone assists. Help one another.”

    I agrree,,, Flora has had to fight this group the only way she knows how,,, carolyn did it by writing books,,, Flora does it with action..Flora got several girls and women OUT of this cult… Carolyn Jessop didn’t.. Although Carolyn had children at the time.

  275. This was on the tape heard last night,

    You have to know how to be sexually excited,” Jeffs said in the recording. “Everyone assists. Help one another.”

    He said this to teenagers. Unbelievable.
    He must never see the light of day outside of prison walls. Never.

  276. These girls are taught total and complete modesty,,, till Warren gets hold of them,, then Warren tells them to take their clothes off,, and be naked?

  277. He tells them about shaving under their arms and their pubic area,, to be clean,, shower all the time in case they are needed for him?
    Im sorry he is a sick F***

  278. Evidently they are fixing to play the tape where the 12yr old was sexually raped

  279. BiB
    you said (up a while) that his behavior is likely learned….really, I would find some comfort in thinking that the group sex thing was his own twist. I agree that treating girls and women as objects/vessels/ is learned and that narcissism is a result of that kind of patriarchy – indeed Thomas Jefferson said much the same about being a slave owner….but could not Jeffs have spiraled into this without having learned it?

  280. I have to wonder where Warren gets the idea that God sanctions his actions. Don’t these people even read the Bible? After all, two of the greatest voices in the New Testament, St Paul and Jesus himself, downplay the importance of marriage as it relates to a spiritual relationship with God.

    St Paul (the Great Lion of God) preached that celibacy was the best condition for worshiping the Almighty, since the believer could then focus all of his/her thoughts, prayers and actions on God.

    Jesus comes right out and declares that there is no marriage in heaven, that we become “like angels,” meaning without gender.

    I blame it all on Joseph Smith, who got around 2,000 years of Christian teaching by making up his own bible, and telling his own wife she would go to hell if she didn’t accept that he could have sex with as many women as he wanted, starting with the nearest teenager.

  281. Amen Anon E Mouse !

  282. HHG – The narcissism, interest in young girls, and the manipulation of women and other underlings was probably learned from his father and other members of the FLDS male hierarchy. The group sex and lesbian activity he may have observed in the cult – or he may have picked up from watching pornography. He learned it from somewhere.

  283. See AnonEMouse it’s much more than just the math of polygyny in practice, it’s all the endless comprimises once you’ve been lead astray by the ‘False Prophet’ that accumulates into a Temple of sins. This belief in a ‘living’ prophet who is getting ongoing revelations adds the real bucket of fuel to the flames. Warren mentined that he had seen gods in heaven conducting these group sex sessions, or maybe he was in hades and Satan has him totally bamboozled. Your points from St. Paul are very valid but are we dealing with hsi teachings or Warren’s latest heavenly vision. “Look up in the sky, it’s a bird, no it’s a plane”, nah it’s just Warren’s latest ritualistic fetish to gratitfy himself with his crib of sheeple.

    I sure hope the subpoena’s to Warren’s wives were redressed, I hate to think they’re standing naked in the YFZ Temple waiting for the Court witness coordinator to call them into trial.

  284. good tweets by gosanangelo and Trib!/lwhitehurst!/@gosanangelo

  285. Sounds like the main tape is going to be after lunch.

    I’m sure the Jury is grateful!

  286. I just recalled something about Bountiful, Canada that left me scratching my head. I thought maybe esBishop Winston Blackmore was wanting/waiting to test the same gender marriage statute in Canada, ot something. Two of Winston’s wives are married to each other in Canada, honest to goodness, that’s a fact. Now the reason has a newer possible twist than I had guessed at before now.

  287. gosanangelo
    At noon, state presenting more dictations detailing what happened to girl after spiritual marriage to #Warrenjeffs . Audiotape soon?
    2 minutes ago Favorite Retweet Reply »

    #Warrenjeffs continues to interrupt, object to pres. of “sacred evidence” on grounds of freedom of religion. Judge repeatedly overrules.
    4 minutes ago Favorite Retweet Reply »

    Other #Warrenjeffs dictations detail group sex or “heavenly sessions” with alleged victims and other sister wives.
    6 minutes ago Favorite Retweet Reply »

    State also presented a dictation from #Warrenjeffs detailing the spiritual marriage ceremony.

  288. MagicUndies

    I live for the day of making the lawyers and politicians who knew accountable! I have simply watched with interest, not thinking I could impact my own desires. But Warren himself as though directed of God, is spilling the beans, Texas Investigators too! What Warren supports as fact, opens the door to take Orrin Hatch head on, Michael Leavitt head on, Ron Thompson head on. All defended the FLDS to the press and I know that background!

    The debates here about Flora are interesting, but who hear knows or has met, Mike King, Ron Barton, James Hill or Gary Engels? Investigators since the mid 1990’s if you include Mike King and what did they gleam out of closed societies? Mr Engels would seem to of gleamed the most, but few know those circumstances.

    I met Flora when I was trying to rescue Ruby, we were pursuing the same agenda separately. Her brother Joe Jr. felt he could stand up to the FLDS and protect his little sister, I said he couldn’t! I needed help and was introduced to Flora then. I had just rescued Caroline Cooke and lost her when Sheriff Kirk Smith had returned her. After Ruby came Cheri Taylor, who by the way was routed in her 3rd home to Flora’s. Few here would have a clue to how we picked up girls in the dead of night and hid them. I called and recorded my calls to the Attorney General and FBI that I had a runner and that I wanted their advise. Routinely or always they said they could not offer ANY legal advise, this was for protection, MINE! Flora prefered to do this in the open, I shared with only TRUSTED contacts.

    Getting inside the FLDS was near imposible, so dumping on Flora for doing more than Barton in Utah or Gibson in Arizona is silly, state investigators were slower and found less. Drugs from William Blacks “meth” lab in hildale was real, samples were turned over to the state. I recorded calls with deputy state attorneys regarding this. W.B. was hands off by Sam Barlow when he was constable. Meetings with Utah DPS Homeland Security were set up and I was there in 2003 with the wife of William and records as in time cards from one of his employees. Making $80. an hour buys silence! Try to remember the 2003 stand off when Washington County Sheriff had Black’s home surrounded, but the Sheriff chose to back off and let William turn himself in, HE DIDN’T, HE FLED TO MEXICO! Don’t believe me, our Mike Watkiss from News 3 TV in Phoenix was covering it.

    Info from within the FLDS that was current was imposible, so don’t rag on Flora, she did better than Deputy State Attorneys. Just cause it wasn’t aired in the press didn’t mean some or many of her leeds did not pan out. When Cheri Taylor ran, we had her exiting cars to walk on foot across state borders, to avoid being charged with transporting minors across state lines, we filmed this. If you didm’t read it in some newspaper, it didn’t mean it never happened. I offered to take a minimum wage job in CC working out of the Justice trailer with Engels, but Terry Goddard, Jan Napolitano & Berns wouldn’t have it. I could of looked under every stone, but with no authority and a corrupt police force, CC was not safe, certainly unsafe for Flora. To often raw research was released to soon, but all info starts as a rumor to be refined.

  289. Heah, RICO shouldn’t these poor jurors be given air-sick bags or somethin’? Everybody knows what milk toast stomachs these evil ‘Gentiles’ have when celestial training is being discussed.

  290. This is the beginning of the end for the Polygamy freaker fairy tales.

  291. CaJim

    Yeah, I heard they were covering their mouths, I think everybody is sick over it.

    Well, we’ve now seen white sex slavery of children in America and how they run it.

  292. Other #Warrenjeffs dictations detail group sex or “heavenly sessions” with alleged victims and other sister wives.
    6 minutes ago Favorite Retweet Reply

    I am starting to wonder if this is prevalent or just an Uncle Warren YFZ special. Maybe this is what the other FLDS top creek dogs meant by they were not aware of his immoral actions.

  293. I happen to admire Flora Jessop,,, she is one Tough cookie, for such a tiny thing.. And the way she fights for rights, is NOT a bad thing at all. Mike Watkiss and Sam Brower and Gary Engels have done so much,, but it has always been Law Enforcement who turned their heads to things going on in Flds.

    And of course,, all these years, its been “mostly” women who have shouted out about what was going on,,, and I trully believe “women” aren’t looked at the same way if it was a man who was telling this story,, they would be heard.

  294. So when is the RICO act going to go in effect with this group???? And shame on my state of Texas for sending all those children back to that HELL HOLE!

  295. gosanangelo
    State has played audiotape of #Warrenjeffs alleged assault of 12-yr-old spiritual wife: lots of heavy breathing, ends w/ prayer
    less than 5 seconds ago

  296. Warren said only HE could have group sex, others who did so would lose Priesthood.

    “And ladies you are NOT to tell anyone!”

    ( meaning their fellow FLSD peeps, as, we all know, they arent allowed off the kiddie sex commune anyway )

    InSessions had that on this am, and its been reported elsewhere.

    So he has one set of child molesting rules for the sheeple and another set for himself.

  297. I was blessed! When John Dougherty was writing his 30 something indepth stories toward his end, he found a “mole” inside the FLDS and began releasing inside info only a first warder could have. He was on fire, but the “mole” needed more than what a journalist could offer. He needed an activist! Using a liason unknown to me for quite some time, I got emails, often several times a day. The purge of 2003, as men were being ousted by Warren, I would get it in minutes and redirect it to both the Arizona & Utah Attorney Generals. So my life line to the MOLE through a middle man, became the AG’s life line to what Warren was doing, almost as it was happening! When I state I had over 1000 emails to and from each state, this was part of that dialog. Once ousted and his family lost, the mole came out in open sight.

    When I speak of Fundamentalist Independents as a greater threat than Warren to invisible children not yet recognized, I state this from a expanded knowledge that came to me after being involved in the FLDS and deeper involved than most investigators, barring Texas, they are my hero’s! What will Utahans do about these other children currently ignored?

    Thanks to Warren, there is a BIGGER ISSUE that needs addressing, but what & who will do it???

  298. From gosangelo:
    AUDIOTAPE: #Warrenjeffs says alleged victims name, “feels good,” female voice audible, some gasps..Think she said “Amen” at end of prayer.
    less than a minute ago Reply
    Undo Retweet
    State has played audiotape of #Warrenjeffs alleged assault of 12-yr-old spiritual wife: lots of heavy breathing, ends w/ prayer

  299. I dont think prayer is going to deliver Warren from this one.

  300. InSession reporting that state has finished its case, after playing the expected audiotape. Upcoming report will give details of what was on the tape.

  301. gosanangelo
    State has played audiotape of #Warrenjeffs alleged assault of 12-yr-old spiritual wife: lots of heavy breathing, ends w/ prayer
    less than 5 seconds ago


    Hell is not quite hot enough yet for Warren Jeffs.

  302. The state has rested its case, and lunch break now,, Judge Walther informed Jeffs after lunch, he would have closing arguments for the defense

  303. gosanangelo
    State rests its case. #Warrenjeffs asks for time to interview witnesses for his defense – so looks like he’ll make one. Has until 3 p.m.

  304. gosanangelo

    State rests its case. #Warrenjeffs asks for time to interview witnesses for his defense – so looks like he’ll make one.

    Has until 3 p.m.


    This will be funny!

  305. What witnesses??? his brother lyle?? willie Jessop??? Naomi Jessop?? who the hell is he going to call as a witness>>

  306. I can’t wait to hear the defense ! How will the jury suppress their laughter !

  307. It is, watergirl. They have no CLUE!

  308. well, it’s coming to a close. we’ll have to see who he puts up on the stand. this is amazing. I knew he was a sick man. but I had no idea just how far he’d gone. I doubt if his people actually knew the truth and believed it, that they’d follow him for half a second. it’s against basically everything they’ve been taught. why do you think Lyle and co went out during certain evidence? they’re trying to keep themselves pure and ignorant of the “sacred” records. maybe they don’t want to know. maybe they do know, but want to be able to feign ignorance when they return to Short Creek. can’t tell the people about what you don’t hear. only that the evil judge allowed sacred records to be aired in a public courtroom.

  309. CAJim: This belief in a ‘living’ prophet who is getting ongoing revelations adds the real bucket of fuel to the flames.


    I read somewhere that Joseph Smith failed to foresee the mistake he made in claiming that anyone can get holy revelations from God, because that’s exactly what happens, with chaos as a result!

    Revelations to the LeBarons, to the Laffertys, to Brian David Mitchell, Warren Jeffs – custom fit to satisfy whatever greedy and corrupt desires they’ve got in their dirty hearts.

  310. Reporter who was in courtroom chokes up describing the audiotape just played and the 12yo’s response when Warren Jeffs asks her how she feels while being raped: “I feel fine, thank you.” Another reporter identified the voice as Merianne. (This is currently on InSession.)

  311. yehaaa

    Oh, indeed, as word gets out it will be called a lie, but it will eventually soak in.

    A lot of people would follow him no matter what, and I mean no matter what

    – they chew Orbit gum.

  312. texasconnie

    Whats that girl going to tell the “Pedophet”?

    Oh, can you wait a few more years till I am tall enough for the ride at 6 flags?

  313. “Don’t think about the pain, think about heaven.”

    I think I’m gonna be sick …..

    Stamp, loved your comment about the Orbit gum. And good point about maybe waiting to rape the girl until she’s old enough to ride the roller coaster.

    Sick, sick, sick.

  314. natecarlisle Nate Carlisle
    Prosecutors claim #WarrenJeffs tape with 12y.o. girl made Aug. 2006, days before he was captured in Nevada. Was to be entered in FLDS record

  315. Well, I am a little confused now about the, “One Man Rule”? Doesn’t it mean that the sheeple have to abide, unquestioningly, the decisions, directions and teachings of their ‘living’ prophet? Isn’t this a tyrannical Theocracy dedicated to the purpose and formed to insure everyone reaches exaltation? You don’t need any ‘Gentiles’, their laws, Constitution, Courtrooms, Public Officials, Legislators or President when you have the ‘Heavenly Mouthpiece’. Now who can argue with that ‘Holy Way’?

  316. TexasMonthly Texas Monthly
    ..#WarrenJeffs on tape: “Blessed you of the lord, come to know god, feel his presence. Stay close to his servant.”

    (TexasMonthly on Twitter)

  317. Ladies look for your eternal bliss to be with Warren on over eighty planets bearing him children, providing him with sexual gratification and never needing to put your clothes back on for all eternity! Are we discussing Heaven or Outter Darkness,’cuz their starting to seem very similar to me? Are we supposed to be feeling ‘Chosen’ and ‘Special’, yet?

  318. why do you think Lyle and co went out during certain evidence? they’re trying to keep themselves pure and ignorant of the “sacred” records. maybe they don’t want to know. maybe they do know, but want to be able to feign ignorance when they return to Short Creek. can’t tell the people about what you don’t hear. only that the evil judge allowed sacred records to be aired in a public courtroom.

    yehaaa6 said this on August 3, 2011 at 1:00 PM

    I think Lyle knows all about it. And he wants to feign ignorance just as you said.

  319. I know I made a comment about Flora earlier this morning. I was NOT attacking her character. I think she is very brave to do what she does. I meant NO personal offense and I dearly hope none was taken.

    I’m so glad she is finally getting her moment. My mother in-law was good childhood friends with Flora for a very long time and admits that she’s been thu alot.

    ONCE AGIAN, all the best Ms. Jessop, Keep tweeting!

  320. The ground breaking part of all this is not that the flds were child molesters, that we know…

    Its the ritual, the mind control, the slavery of mind and body, recorded on tape, that makes this a truly historic moment – that hopefully will start to turn the tide of abuse for these poor children raised in these fundy homes.

  321. gosanangelo

    Expert witness lists includes a guy in Georgia, a TX doctor and a Salt Lake City-based forensics/genomics company.

    3 minutes ago


    After those tapes, Warren is going to try to say the baby isnt his? Good luck Poindexter!

  322. Okay. On the defense side we have his expert witness list: Ken Driggs, John Walsh, and Ryan Buchanan (DNA guy). I don’t believe any other witness list has been posted.

  323. texasconnie

    That Orbit gum cmmcl just rang the bell!

    I found this clip on youtube, must be the one they play in England?

    ha ha ha!

  324. A doctor and a forensics guy? Whats he getting at here?

    Surely he won’t try to disprove the DNA. He must know thats ludicrus.

    Maybe another medical angle?

    But those three witnesses are the ones his attorneys had in mind right? So could he be going with different ones? Ugh so mad I have to leave for work as soon as it starts back up.

  325. Ah, this is his defense!

    Late Stage Fumarase Deficiency

  326. Funny, stamp.

  327. “Your Honor I object”!

    “Okay, Mr. Jeffs what is it now”?

    “Your Honor I object to the objection I last made before the objections you overruled to object to my objection from my objection to the supposed objection that I objected to that objection prior to my objection to the objection that I had objected to hence”.

    “OVERULED”! “Now sit down and shut up, Mr. Jeffs”!

  328. Lyle DOES know all about it. He has heard that tape. Hardly anyone else though. Anyone else who has heard that tape — or had an idea of the contents — are out already. Lyle has more to lose than most when the truth comes out. The main reason he’s down there is to get some miraculous transfer of “authority” to himself. I don’t know if that’ll happen, but it doesn’t matter. All he has to do is come here and SAY it happened.

    He’s gonna come back here with a thoroughly sanitized version of what happened. I’m sure what we’ll be told is that Warren has “allowed” himself to be further persecuted to “give us more time to prepare” for his deliverance. If the truth of the matter becomes known here, and the pressure on Lyle increases, he will take the “elect” (most brainwashed) and get down to R17 where he will have total control over what they hear and see. Unfortunately, I’m also afraid Lyle will go after the UEP Presidency.

    Warren knows he’s toast, and so does Lyle.

  329. Beth Karas on In Session, evidently knew who Willie Jessop was, talked to him,, and said,, How could you not know this was going on?? He said, he knew there was problems , but he had no idea the degree it was happening.. And Beth also said,, Warrren Jeffs masterbates alot,,, they found this out from the Jailers of warren jeffs

  330. Lyle, Wendell,, Merrill are All responsible, should be held accountable for their actions,, even Willie the thug should be held accountable for the shit he has done,, Lying for the prophet,, Lying to the media, Lying to the senate committe held in Texas

  331. Ken Driggs is the one w ho says, Flds is a religious organization, who are peaceful , kind people, Blah Blah, and IF he testifies, he is going to look REALLY stupid compared to what this jury has already heard

  332. Wow, Taco. That is really bad news on Lyle. Is there any chance at all he’ll be better than WSJ?

  333. 33 objections warren yelled in court today

  334. I would think after Warren’s proclivities with his sister, male cousin, own daughter, his father’s wives and under aged girls that his sexuality, conscience and obvious rejection of his wickedness, more or less dooms him into his sinfulness. I have always wondered how Seth Jeffs being caught with his cousin Nathaniel Allred near Colorado Springs, CO suffered no Warren ‘shunning’ or ‘handlng’, seemed like a Priesthood disciplining would have ensued but maybe Nathaniel is very popular, so Warren forgave him.

  335. BIB, if she were lying about you and your family you would feel differently, IMO.

    She is saying what you want to hear so I can guess why you are enthralled. Sex sells.

  336. No, not enthralled Anon 2:18 pm – I understand that abused subjects have different perceptions of their experiences than you or I have, and therefore I have compassion… this is a basic psychological principle. We are tired of your diatribes, take it elsewhere.

  337. I understand that the sheeple in Short Creek held exBishop Willie E. Jessop in a higher regard than Lyle Jeffs. Lyle has a mean streak and is known to be too tough with some folks in the past, his recent bisopric has been fewer complaints but the FLDS Church is under severe scrutiny, as well. I think that exBishop Willie E. Jessop’s star may be in ascendency but another schism within the FLDS Church appears to be foreseeable. The YFZ Raunch seems doomed to become albeit a ghost town settlement, turn out the light and lock up a chain.

  338. Are you kidding Anon, she’s not just making it all about sex. Though ironically, there does seem to be alot of sex going on! Tapes anyone?

    Flora has been through alot and she’s got way more cajones to keep on talking about it. She’s gotten girls out of the creek. She is a fighter, when many just shup up and go away.

    I’m not going to back up everything she says because I don’t claim to have a firsthand knowledge of everything she witnessed at her time in the crick.

    You on the other hand apparently have firsthand knowlegde, so while I cannot fully back her up or knock her down, you can. So share, or calm down.

  339. I’m not worried about whoever Warren puts on the stand. I believe the prosecutors will utterly destroy them on cross–if Warren doesn’t make his own witnesses look stupid first.

    The closing ought to be interesting–and where we’re likely to get a heavy dose of sermonizing.

  340. Anyone else sick to their stomach after learning the tape details? I pray to keep my lunch down during work. But you can bet I won’t be saying “Amen”

  341. Utterly disgusting, Ariel.

  342. Someone reported that the women on the jury were crying. Is there any confirmation of that ?

  343. Third Cousin said: Okay. On the defense side we have his expert witness list: Ken Driggs, John Walsh, and Ryan Buchanan (DNA guy).

    Does he expect the DNA guy to say it’s really god’s holy seed, by way of Jeff’s, and therefore not rape? The DNA ‘changed’ [didn’t they try that one already?] That the DNA is holy and sacred?

  344. Ariel, my heart is so heavy for these girls who were so horribly abused and demeaned — and deceived. It is indeed sickening.

  345. My bet is that the DNA expert’s angle is that the FLDS is so inbred that ordinary rules on DNA testing are not applicable. Let’s see…

  346. BIB According to reporter Christi Paul, at least one woman juror was crying. Christi herself choked up while on the air when she had to report what was on the tape. One male juror was glaring at Jeffs, Christi said. And some (don’t know how many) of the jurors held their hands over their mouths or eyes. She also spoke of a “heaviness” in the courtroom while the tape was played.

  347. Just got off the phone with a creeker! Rulon Jeffs was into oral sex, posibly group sex? Rulon had close circuit camera’s to all his wives rooms. Dialog with Rulon in counciling sessions had Rulon speaking of womens body parts like some one breeding cattle. Rulon had a gutter mind when he questioned his flock about sex, so its highly probable that Warren got some of his ideas, certainly some of dads women, Naomi included, before being married to her. I think he expanded his fantasy, but my guess is Rulon got a bit kinky toward his end.

  348. BiB, funny….but sad…

  349. Ha,, I really hope Ken Driggs if he is a witness for warren, doesn’t say something like that, becuase its against the law in Texas to In Breed to! So warren loses either way

  350. A question from my phone conversation, Warren is the only one who can preside over marriages, so were there any new ones since he was incarcerated? If there were, then did he do them by jail phone? Where the jail phones were being listened in on? No marriages since his capture 5 years ago would be a long time for the faithful!

  351. The info on Rulon could go along way in explaining Warren’s actions….if this was a ‘shared’ dad/son activity. It’s been said W was R’s favorite. Maybe R let W watch the close circuit TV and ‘monitor’ him with his wives. All just a disgusting guess…but….

  352. He allowed Merrill Jessop to perform marriages, but Ive heard Merrill Jessop has been excommuicated

  353. Jay, thanks…..the oral sex aversion seems right, I recall that Warren was heard to ask about that in the past and shocked some of his followers on why he inquired about that obviously sinful behavior. Warren parted ways with Winston Blackmore over Warren inquiring to one of about Winston’s wives about Winston’s sexual preferences and Blackmore took great umbrage at his inquiry, saying,”It was none of Jeffs damned business to ask”, some rumors said Warren’s inquiry was concerned about Winston’s practice of oral sex.

  354. People do not develop these types of sexual behaviors de novo, they see the behaviors modeled, and they learn the behaviors. So now we see the connection between Warren’s sexual behavior and Rulon’s antics, and we know of Warren’s interest in pornography. Frightening stuff – I wonder how many of Warren’s siblings were also adversely affected through contact with their father ?

  355. Who the hell cares, just SHUT FLDS down!!! Get help for these people who have been brainwashed, and abused!

  356. Now that the State of Utah has to pay a 4 million dollar tab to hold the UEP together, they might get serious about doing something.

    Oh, wait…. I wont hold my breath.

    They chew Orbit gum in SLC too.

  357. They will pay the 4 million dollar fee, and they will continue to do absolutely nothing in Utah. The status quo will continue.

  358. I can not back this up, but I seem to remember that Rebecca Musser wanted out as fast as possible before Jeffs got her and part of the testimony was that he had prior chastized her for not performing oral sex on Rulon, only it was not stated in a way that made it100% clear… just that there was something Rulon wanted her to do and she wouldn’t and Jeffs’ then gave her a lecture on her job to do whatever Rulon wanted… It was back during one of the prior trials?? or maybe an interview….

    Maybe somebody has a better memory than I do and could back it up…

  359. excuse me the last anonymous on oral sex and Ms. Musser was me….HHG.

    By the way I am going to give myself a pat on the back for suggesting that Jeffs was marrying all the young pretty ones to his dad as lay away gifts for himself.


  360. Apologies if this has already been posted — great summary of yesterday’s testimony, including excerpt of “heavenly session” read by Ranger Hanna into testimony and courtroom reactions and Warren’s objections:

  361. Well Warren is currently conducting his defense – my guess is that he wont call witnesses to the stand.

    I’m thinking just another speech.

  362. No wonder Mark Shurtleff was in such a bad mood the other day when interviewed about Flds,,,,, He lost his case on paying Wisan and attorneys and all that for the trust.

  363. “She experienced the heavenly session and obtained a greater testament,” Hanna quoted Jeffs as writing about his sexual encounter with the girl. “She felt the all consuming fire of heaven.”

    1. Heavenly session seems to be sex with one – or evidently more

    2. The “all consuming fire” isnt heaven, Warren – but yeah…

  364. Stamp, I appreciate your RICO avatar more than ever. May we live to witness the day the FLDS is dismantled as a criminal enterprise. Not to mention a sex cult.

  365. You have to know how to be sexually excited and to help each other … and you have to be ready for the time I need your comfort,” a man’s voice says.

    “This is your mission. This is how you abide the law,” the man adds.

    Many jurors lowered their heads and closed their eyes as they listened to the recordings.

    At one point, the man says, “Take your clothes off. Do it right now.”

    The sounds of crying followed.

    “Just don’t think about the pain; you’re going to heaven,” the man says at one point.

    “The world’s view of sexual relations is selfish; the celestial view is not,” he says at another.

  366. Can anybody tell me whethet any of the under-aged girls were from Canada?

  367. Before the court adjourned Tuesday night, jurors were shown a photograph of a closet where 12 white robes hung. A closeup of one of the robes showed a label with the name of one of the purported victims. Prosecutors said the girls wore the robes during these “heavenly sessions.”

  368. Warren is giving Utah a new nickname

    Hell Elevated

  369. There were girls Sent to canada for marriages

  370. gosanangelo
    Judge reminds #Warrenjeffs she advised against self-representation, that trial has been pending since ’08, that he’s been in TX since Dec.
    half a minute ago gosanangelo
    When court reconvened, #Warrenjeffs again asked for more time to prepare a defense. Judge denied: told him he had time to prepare over wknd.

  371. Warren started with the speech, then it looks like he realized he was holding an empty bag and requested more time on the clock.

    Answer, “Keep Sweet and git r done”


    #Warrenjeffs said he didn’t have time to prepare “under circumstances o incarceration”
    1 minute ago

    Judge reminds #Warrenjeffs she advised against self-representation, that trial has been pending since ’08, that he’s been in TX since Dec.
    2 minutes ago

    When court reconvened, #Warrenjeffs again asked for more time to prepare a defense. Judge denied: told him he had time to prepare over wknd.
    4 minutes ago

    BREAKING: #Warrenjeffs delivering opening statement, touching on importance of religion, history of U.S., establishment of 1st amendment…
    6 minutes ago

  372. There were also girls sent down from Canada for marriages.

  373. TC


    Racketeer Influenced and Corrupt Organization

    The FLDS have always fit that bill, would like to see Federal action. How bad do things need to get?

    There are still hundreds of children penned on that kiddie sex commune.


    We know that there were Canadian girls there – my guess is yes they were abused, but I dont know by whom.

    There was an unbelievable amount of abuse on that cult commune, hard to imagine ANY girls of the right age (12 to 13+) escaping it.

  374. Yes to girls from Canada!

    It strikes me that Warren will take a bigger hit than the FLDS faith, since he kept these actions, even a secret from many or most of his followers. A logical reason to see this has acting alone and not in his faith.

    Though in the all boys tree house, sharing such a secret and sharing the experience might of bonded the boys together!.

    From the phone call, a victory of some kind today for Wisam and the court appointed UEP trustees. The Shurtleff issue maybe, I didn’t ask! 2 of the court appointed UEP Trusttee’s have remained close. Took a trip to Yosemite & Sequoia National Park with one of them earlier this month.

    I really want to make the trek to Cane Beds soon, near Coloradio City, Ben Bistline is dying and he was so much a part of this issue. His early book the POLYGAMIST helped us all and laid the foundation for most of the issues investigated. It would be nice to honor him in life, not waiting for his WAKE to do so.

  375. gosanangelo

    #Warrenjeffs on ppls subjected to religious persecution/freedom: “still maintained through courts that they have right to worship”


    Warren warren warren

    You numbskull, worship all you want.

    You will have plenty of time to concentrate on that once you are convicted of your despicable crimes against nature.

  376. Jay

    Best wishes to Ben, and I am glad this “dispensation” is being “handled” during his time.

    There are a lot of folks who saw this coming and did the right thing… and as you noted, a lot of people who either helped it run or ran interference, yes even paid govt officials who enabled these crimes to fester.

    This is a huge victory to everyone who stands against these abuses.

    Its going to have a huge ripple effect, 8.0 magnitude on Temple Square too.

  377. Jay,
    in what way do you think that we could honor Ben – a gathering, a donation?

  378. Judge imposed 30-minute limit on Jeffs’ opening statement. It never addressed evidence but was all about religious persecution. The defense has called FLDS member J.D. Roundy to the stand.

  379. Any sheeple in court today?

  380. Can’t wait to hear Mr. Roundy’s apologetics. This should be interesting.

  381. HE HE JD Roundy – what a lovely picture of honor that guy is.

    Why, he is just another of Warren’s bootlickers, cant wait to see what he has to say.

  382. Maybe he was running the audio / video for Warren, and can explain the 18 minute gap?

  383. Guess calling Willie, Merril or Wendell is out of the question Warren?

    Had to reach down to the bottom of the barrel and pull out a Roundy?

  384. Stamp — LOL @ 18-minute gap and Orbit gum. You have provided the only light-hearted moments in this very heavy, heartbreaking day. Thanks for that.

  385. Roundy is seen here carrying Detoto’s briefcase up the stairs, check the pics, looks like pic 9 of the ten.

    He looks like a cartoon character.

  386. The example I used of Warren defending himself was a man with a nail gun, putting nails in his coffin as fast as he can reload the next cartridge. Its got more nails than wood in it right now.

    I expect he will help the LDS church as well today, trying to justify his belief out of theirs and Joseph Smith’s. I can only imagine the campaign PR firm that is trying to ramp Mitt Romney up! Damage control and distancing one group from the other.

    Reflecting on Joseph Smith he too tried to practise his extra marital affairs in secret from the church and flock. Polygamy was only public after the trek to Utah, long after Smith was martyrd.

  387. He’s questioning Roundy about the Book of Mormon right now.

  388. DaphneB, I think your question would be any of the 10 or so ‘Child Brides’ to be given in evidence during the “Bad Acts” portion of the trial?

    Texas Twister hasn’t posted today and I would guess that he/she might be able to answer that, if so I will contact with the info. Can anyone else here help with this question?

    Twister, oh spinner where art thou?

    Any updates on when to expect Chief Justice R. Bauman’s findings on the polygamy reference case?

  389. TC

    Well, ya know me – if I cant laugh it off it would tick me off too bad.

    I guess it helps when they dress up like pioneers in the heat of summer and act all holier than thou.

    Now EVERYONE is going to be making fun of these jokers.

  390. TC

    “He’s questioning Roundy about the Book of Mormon right now.”

    AHHH! The Get Smart “Put the Jury to Sleep” defense!

    That old rascal!

  391. I hope they’re ready to thoroughly cross this guy! Isn’t he one of the fathers who married off his little girl to one of the earlier defendants? Do I have the right Roundy? The YFZ gate”guard”? Or I could just be waaaayy off….If I am, please remember that I’m a little punch drunk from information overload at this point.

  392. I do hope they take the rest of Warren’s writings and start handing out warrents for arrests to all who are documented to help him. They don’t say whether his dictations say who was the witnesses. I bet Warren recorded it. Round them up! Also wonder what CPS is thinking right now about all those children and what to do with them.

  393. Warren of course loves him self, but can he call himself to the stand and risk being cross examined? Naomi still loves him, maybe she could offer a few kind words and be his good character witness, but can you image her being cross questioned? There is always CRAZY RUTH, if cross questioned, know one really knows what she is talking about. He could call his dead father up, he often said his father would be raised up and reknewed! No pets, dogs were all killed, he never had a loyal dog who loved him no matter what! So who could love him enough to vouch for him?

    Mad Bill M. Hugh M. Thotman? The blogs were filled with would be friends and well wishers, will they abandon him now? Talk is cheap, but who will stand before God and defend this mans life? Parker would do it for money, but attorneys are no more than paid friends.

  394. Ok, for the person who was taking bets the other day. How about once the jury goes to confer – a bet on how many minutes till they come back with a verdict?

  395. Can they stop calling us ‘Persecutors’ now? I think we’ve risen to at least be called “Pervert Avoiders”. I still like it when Celia and MadeWacky call me a ‘bigot and hatemonger’,’cuz I really hate Pedophiles and I am very bigotted to that viewpoint. Don’t you think “Big Idiot and Humdinger” make a lovely posting duo on the ‘SLTrib’?

    Heah, Bill MadeWacky howse he gonna appeal his own representation?

  396. I’ve always thought ‘heavenly sessions’ really meant sex…but, also thought it was maybe just my own twisted interpretation of things. Seems my ‘twisted thinking’ was a bit closer to the truth than I care to think about.
    The jury will probably need psycholigical help after the trial. How do you get these things outta your head when the trial is done? It will be very interesting to hear them speak, if they choose too, after trial.

  397. Jay, if you’re going to represent yourself and your movement in a way that is becoming of all your ideals, please learn how to spell: “Know one”? Please, Jay.

  398. Sam Roundy Jr was CC Police Chief and lied about Rodney Holm’s underage wife Ruth in a Mike Watkiss interview. Jonnathon Roundy was a police officer too I think. He took an underage girl I worked with, but her name escapes me now, I worked on a federal check fraud forgery issue with the girl after she had left. But there are several Roundy’s, which one?

    When Ruby Jessop disappeared for 35 days she spent time with a Roundy in Idaho. Whats the first name?

  399. There are attorney that have been hired that are watching and reading this board. Slander and libel suits are coming. I recommend that we’re a little more careful with names.

  400. Actually, a part of Warren’s prophecy in court has come true, quite a few of us have been feeling sick, light headed and a little nausea.

    WaterG the verdict should be under an hour to come to agreement.

  401. lwhitehurst Lindsay Whitehurst

    Testifying for #WarrenJeffs defense, witness is reading passage describing Joseph Smith’s first vision of God. #polygamy @sltrib


    YUP He is going to stonewall with the BOM.

    If you cant dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them with bullshit.

  402. Ahhhh, to be a fly on the wall in the jury room!!!

  403. CaJim ha ha

    Indeed, he had a feeling everyone would get sick once they heard the evidence!

    Likely happened a lot around him.

    The Conviction will be like Alka Seltzer.




  404. I really like to see the other wives indited, hope the DA knows who they are, also the parents of the young girls. I mean they all helped him when he was a fugitive and now that!

  405. Thanks for the heads up! I would clarify that the above was a real question — not an effort to imply anything about the guy testifying/reading from the Book of Mormon today. The gentleman at the gates of YFZ was identified by name in several media reports. Looking now. Thanks again!

  406. Learning to spell is to late for me!

    My wife is a teacher, I hear this spelling thing every day.

    I prefer to be a bull in a china shop and break things, sooner or later some one gets sent to deal with me. Shoot me or tie me to a chair and re educate me.

    Sadly I type with one finger and stare at the keys, one of those!

    I know it hurts the eyes of those who are learn-ed, my wife has a double masters degree, so far…..

  407. OOOPS

    State: “Mr. Roundy is not on trial…His personal experiences and beliefs have no relevance to trial,” sexual assault charges.


    The old “Baffle them” technique didnt last long! OH DANG!

  408. Not to worry Jay – aint it funny, right when Warren is going down to the chopping block, at his own hand no less –

    someone criticizes your spelling? The horror – ha ha ha!

  409. Did anyone ever hear what happened to the 16 year old girl that made the call to Child Protection that caused authorities to raid the compound and take an interest in this finally! I recall at the time hearing that they didn’t find her among the women/children that they took away from there. I’ve thought of her as this pedophile/rapist is on trial and how brave and strong she must have been to make the call as she would have been just as brainwashed and abused as many others.

    This is all so disgusting and disturbing to think such abuse has been able to go on for so long. I’m from British Columbia, Canada where Bountiful is and so I’m thinking of our police, child protection, government when I say that. How could so many people be turning a blind eye to so much abuse.

  410. RT @SamBrowerpi: I wept in court today when they played the tape of the little girl with #WarrenJeffs. Need some time to compose myself.

  411. He should weep! He and other who gave their children away may be steps from an indictment, themselves…one csn only hope!! But, to try and claim ignorance of what was going on isn’t the best defense, either. I’m tired of the “I was just doing what I was told to do” excuse, when things like this happen.

  412. Not a concern, with these new visuals, we will gain a foot hold on control of the UEP and may be get some traction on the independents that still go on ignored.

    There are more battles to come and frankly rescuing 5 girls in 2001, not a one of them cared about how I spelled their names.

    I would prefer to be thought of as a lousy speller, but a do’er than the reverse.

    We all do what we can, some prefer to critique instead. When my phone bill was $300. a month taking victim calls, I wasn’t worth the critique.

    Oh Well!

  413. Maybe thats why Warren’s Prophet schtick is so messed up, God typo’ed his name… he he he

    And thanks for all you do Jay – this must be quite the fulfillment. You were one of those who had boots in the field helping others.

  414. mc

    Sam Brower is a PI who has helped put Warren the monster where he is today.

    One of the good guys. He was on Dr Drew last Friday with others

  415. Judge just called for recess, not sure how long

  416. Sam Brower will be on Dr Drew again tonite

  417. Heah, RICO isn’t the Book of Mormon still listed in the US Congressional Library under works of fiction/novel? How could this book lend any authoritative strnegth to Warren’s defense? I let Texas Asst. AG Prosecutor Eric Nichols do his job but these boys may be making it too easy for him.

  418. Ooops, yes, I realllly misread that. I was thinking Roundy said that on the stand…got my names mixed up! Sorry Sam!!! I’m waiting to start his book, just too much going on now [trial wise] to get started.

  419. Bless everyone that did something, anything that they could do, to stand up to this monster.

  420. mc,

    I figured as much!

    I think the BOM defense is getting him nowhere fast.

    Interesting he didnt whip out a KJ Bible too, and a computer with internet access.

    He could have kept them there forever.

    But alas, the Judge gives him enough rope until he proves he has nothing but an empty bag.

  421. SanAngelo tweet:

    After court recessed, about a dozen boxes of paperwork shuttled through security. Asked fmr #WarrenJeffs atty if that’s his evidence:”Maybe”

  422. Watergirl, I’m going with 45 minutes.


    ~~ Intermission ~~

  424. gosanangelo

    #WarrenJeffs first witness, an #FLDS member, was on stand for ~1 hr before judge called a recess. Jeffs had him read lotsa Mormon scriptures



    He didnt get to the part where it says its ok to molest children in orgies?

    Keep reading Warren, its not there….

  425. “There are attorney that have been hired that are watching and reading this board. Slander and libel suits are coming. I recommend that we’re a little more careful with names.

    Anonymous said this on August 3, 2011 at 5:00 PM”


    Trembling in fear !

  426. Okay,, his closing has absolutely NOTHING to do with the charge against him,,and NO one wants to hear the entire book of mormon read,,, He is charged with Sexual Assault, Not not knowing what his principals of his religion are

  427. Apparently he’s now onto the Pearl of Great Price.

  428. There are attorney that have been hired that are watching and reading this board. Slander and libel suits are coming. I recommend that we’re a little more careful with names.

    Anonymous said this on August 3, 2011 at 5:00 PM

    Will Warren Jeffs be the attorney representing the plaintiffs ?

  429. Warren is getting some incomparable courtroom experience.

    Right up there with Charlie Manson and OJ Simpson.

    Where are those guys right now?

  430. So I guess Roundy was his bed time story reader, or did he ever actually make a real point?

    And where are the rest of the 12 Dwarfs?

  431. “There are attorney that have been hired that are watching and reading this board. ”

    They better call Mitt and Jon and tell them to save their money.

  432. Anon, in Constitutional Law class we learned that truth is an absolute defense to libel and slander allegations.

  433. There are attorney that have been hired that are watching and reading this board. Slander and libel suits are coming.


    It’s not slander if it’s true!

  434. Slander only applies to lies, if not a truth!

    Assault can be verble, adding battery when contact has been made. Speaking ill of Warren is no worse than Warren putting a curse on the judge and jury.

    What helps is coming forward, reporting some abuses, then relying on the status of being a protected witness/informant/victim. Title 18, section 1512 of the US Code. Its why I insult the attorneys who ran interference for the FLDS. I have filed many complaints, named names and wait for one or two to get the guts to fight back.

    I insulted Orrin Hatch using SCOOP a New Zealand publication to expose his defense of the FLDS, the senator considers me a flea or a knat, but still isn’t likely to sue, I have his attorneys letter trying to distance his clients statements.

    If some attorney is watching this blog then maybe this issue can get more coverage. But I hope it was not Anon who suggested such. Its time we used real names and called a spade a spade! Hiding from the FLDS or apologist was pre Texas.

  435. Well it shouldnt be of any surprise to anyone, but attorneys have been reading – and commenting – on this board for, well, quite some time.

    But let me guess – Jay really gets under certain peeps skin.

    Maybe talking about the failures of government figures like Hatch, Leavitt, or Kirk Smith?

    They arent going to sue anyone, because of DISCOVERY RULES their weasle ways of enabling the local yokel felons would be exposed in public.

    And that wouldnt sit well on Temple Square.

    They are going to hunker down like good little boys on their knees and pray this blows over.

  436. Recalling a bit of the less epic run-on snippets of Unkidub’s revelation t’other day- the “Stop! Now!” part— my daughter just told me to ask if we can somehow get Warrant to try to recall if he’s ever heard any of the “little ladies” say those very same words- “Stop!” “Now!” , that is

  437. Jay, I like your straight forwardness. And your spelling makes me smile.

  438. he he Lindsay, I luv ya!


    lwhitehurst Lindsay Whitehurst

    Should add mainstream #LDS church renounced #polygamy over 100 years ago


    Well, that is perhaps the funniest tweet I’ve ever seen!

    I guess its a sign the LDS will be fighting off this stigma for – YES!

    Another 100 years!

  439. The English have a way with words, hmmm

    Jurors in tears as court hears ‘sex tape’ Warren Jeffs made with his three wives – including his 12-year-old ‘bride’

    Prosecution rests their case in child sex assault trial

    Jurors cover their mouths as graphic recording played in court

    Alleged victim referred to by name by polygamist leader during tape

    Earlier court was played recordings of instructions to young wives

    including showering before going near him and maintaining body hair

    Pictures show head of Mormon sect with the young redhead he is accused of raping

    He told his young wives they were ‘honourable vessels’ and journalised about how they were ‘willing to obey’

    Read more:

  440. I am betting 15 minutes for the jury to decide.

    let me make sure I get this straight, correct where I am wrong…

    Uncle Warren brushes Short Creek off his shoes.
    He takes the money from the sheeple of the creek, leaving most in poverty and buys land in Texas and declares he is Yearning for Zion.
    He hand picks sheeple to move there.
    Men to be templebuilders to buld a temple with a bed and houses.
    Selected women maybe templebuilders wives may be not.
    He hand selects children who he tells the selected women to treat as their own. The sheeple in creek agree to give their children along with their tithe.
    He has a big house built for himself.
    He has another big house built next to his already big house – with the two houses inside gates, within a fully gated community that has guard towers.
    He keeps weapons in the temple in case he needs them.
    Canadian head who claims to be a break away from him but agrees to hand deliver 12 year olds in exchange for 12 year olds hiding them in RV’s for the ride down. and no doubt back up.
    He gives out sex training sessions to quorum of 12 girls who are so young he has to train them how to feel because they are too young to discover it for themselves.
    Days after having a 12 yo in the temple he is caught in Nevada with his brother and a favorite wife in a red caddy full of computers and tapes.
    And while all this is going on- he kicks half the men out of the creek and in the end kicks out his top flunkies.

  441. What do you think this means?

    #warrenjeffs trying to “throw witness under a bus” state says, as Jeffs has FLDS man answer in ways that could implicate polygamy.

  442. gosanangelo
    #warrenjeffs silence in defense between his own questions lasts several minutes, opens and closes mouth saying nothing between questions
    3 minutes ago Favorite Retweet Reply

    Judge says #warrenjeffs must stop questions just about religion to FLDS witness

  443. A lot of these courtroom tweets are very cryptic, but this one takes the cake !

  444. RICO, I remember asking Modern Hughley. if he thought Warren had destroyed legalized polygamy for nanother hundred years or at least for the remainder of his time here on Earth. Hughley, forever the optomist, later still spoke of legalizing polygamy, too funny. We’re probably on the verge of a rash nof legilative re-writes of most felony rape statutes in the Rocky Mountain States and guys living in Maryland or Florida will cry for Libertarian ideales to be adapted or protected.

  445. thank you Stamp for the video. I will laugh for days!

  446. Hi Jay,

    Glad to see you show up for this. I figured you would.

    After it’s over, would you contact me through the same person you did before. I would like to talk to you.

    “The mole”, “nameless and still alive” and others. 🙂

  447. What do you think this means?
    #warrenjeffs trying to “throw witness under a bus” state says, as Jeffs has FLDS man answer in ways that could implicate polygamy.
    Third Cousin said this on August 3, 2011 at 7:38 PM

    I think the prosecutor is referring to the fact that the witness could implicate himself in a crime by being asked to answer questions about his views on polygamy. Remember, Warren is facing an additional prosecution for bigamy in Texas. This witness could subject himself to a similar prosecution.

  448. If you get HLN (Headline News Network, Sam Brower scheduled to be on Dr. Drew (8:00 pm CDT); Flora Jessop to be on Joy Behar show (9:00 p.m. CDT).

  449. Well, Warren has been talking since 3:36 this afternoon, and said shit! Wonder how much longer this is going to continue

  450. Court just recessed until 9:00 a.m. tomorrow.

  451. Warren is just stonewalling along, figure she will give him some more rope but lookout Warren, there is a noose on it!

  452. Sam and Elissa, Flora and Rebecca on Dr Drew right now = actually Rebecca is up next

  453. Anonorama — I think you’re right about the “noose.” I imagine that tomorrow Judge Walther will tell Warren to call more witnesses or wrap it up.

    I thought Elissa looked very pretty tonight and she acquitted herself well. No idea who Rebecca was (telephone caller) but she made some good comments and added to the discussion.

  454. I figure that Warren tossed out Roundy as a sacraficial red herring, bragging he is a polygamist in front of the judge in an attempt to disrupt his trial.

    The judge stayed on task. If they want Roundy they can pick him up anytime and they have his testimony to back it up.

    Figure they will keep up the boring book reading, which is of course off topic, as long as the judge allows it but of course there has to be a limit.

  455. Actually I think Jeffs had Roundy testify that there is a living prophet and only one. The next step is to have him testify that Jeffs is the prophet and then the next question is if the prophet can do any wrong….

  456. My favorite trial comment so far …

    #warrenjeffs prosecutor says giving Jeffs too much time during his silences “unfruitful.” judge: “I’m used to a lot unfruitful exercises”

  457. Lest we not forget, Mitt Romney is making another run for the roses! A Presidential shot which may take 100-200 million dollars and any connection between LDS & FLDS is worth posturing over. Sue? The PR team at SLC Central knows who I am, I have had a recording up on YouTube for almost 3 years, the LDS response to activist requesting help.

    We still have apologist!

    The FLDS zealots who still feel the need to spin this. Certainly Warren has my name, next to Flora’s, we made his diary list. Sue not likely, pray for our death a long with the judge, most certainly.

    We still have the LDS, who yes monitor most of the blogs, they are here to tell us the FLDS are nothing like them. Jeffs audios that use the Mormon discourses should be some clue to how similiar they really are. The 3 year old YouTube video was a call into Mr. Otterson at the direction or request of former Utah State Senator Scott Howell, Scott a serious LDS Gentleman of integrity and character thought the mainstream church would want to listen to what I needed help for.

    Then we have the misguided patriots, constitutionalist, religious rights groups, etc. These believe any group has a right to self govern and breed any way they see fit, at any age. Trampling on Jeffs rights, might mean these groups or people are next. To me these folks are the most dangerous, like the Oklahoma City bombers. Bill “mad” whacky is in this group. They are wide left and wide right! On the SLC Trib blog these groups were telling us Mary mother of Jesus was age 12 and willing to fight for a belief that age 12 was old enough.

    Most of us know the horrific blog battles that took place since the April 2008 YFZ raid and know the opposition by the way they post, inspite of it saying Anon or another alias.

    I think we are all under the skin of the 2 groups above!

  458. Anonymous said this on August 3, 2011 at 7:55 PM

    Ah the “Mole” you sacraficed more than these bloggers will know. Wasn’t sure you wanted to be named, you are no secret today however!

    My battle or argument now is not Jeffs or the FLDS, but those who did nothing when help was requested. Politicians, lawyers, law enforcement and so on.

    I haven’t had dialog with your liason in a few years, but the same guy we met with on Christmas 2005 on Creekbed Road is a good middle man now. Just got back from Yosemite National Park with him and his son. I want to make the trip soon and want to see Ben before he passes. Katie emailed that he is still hanging in.

    Next to you I have NO GUTS, but couldn’t mis this!

    My hat off to you! You made me look good!


  459. In response to Scumbag Barney, I’m sure the picture itself will be good enough for the jury, but we do have to remember it’s a Texas jury. You boys looked at the picture and could somehow see his tongue down her throat. That makes for a great sexual fantasy, but HARDLY enough proof beyond a reasonable doubt that the tape depicted a “Rape” of anyone.

    And THEN we have the pesky problem of the girl being in CPS custody and undergoing a SANE exam. Let’s not forget, she was one of the girls who was supposed to be “Pregnant”. Not only was she not pregnant, to CPS and CASAs GREAT dismay, she was found to have an intact hymen.

    Now if Warren sports a 1 inch penis, your fantasy may STILL be a viable one, but I have to imagine that Johnie Hanna has given Warren enough “Cavity Searches” to not only satisfy his sexual cravings, but knows that Warren has a schmuck slightly longer than that.

    As y’all know, ALL the children were given SANE exams in Captivity INCLUDING BOTH girls. Are we surprised that the Doctor who gave Veda her exam testified, and that Merrianne’s Doctor was no where to be seen? Not in the slightest. Veda’s Doctor helped to prove Veda gave birth to a child. On the other hand, Merrianne’s Nurse (R.N.) proved that Merrianne was still intact in April, 2008.

    Now I KNOW you boys ain’t too bright, but if the Medical Records PROVE she was a virgin in 2008, your fantasies are nothing more than wasted seed spilled onto the ground.

    By the way, withholding exculpatory evidence may be honkey dory in barbies court, but the Bar frowns upon it…BIGTIME when it becomes public in open Court. Nichols’s rotund pal is going to have a LOT of explaining to do when barbie is caught with her knickers down.

    I don’t often give Bill M the time of day, but he needs to know that there is no way that Merrianne had an intact hymen since there was a tape played in court today that Warren recorded of Merrianne being RAPED by Warren himself with 3 of his other wives standing around watching and holding Merrianne down. You are the one with fantasies Bill. You have no medical records of any of these children. You are the one lying out your ASS because there wasn’t a SANE examination given to any of the children.

    Your hero just got shown to be a rapist of not 1, but 2 little girls.

  460. Wonder if John Lester ever found love?

    he he he

    Yeah, there have been a lot of agendas arm wrestling over this.

    Most of them have finally gone away with their tail between their legs, and the few remaining like ill bill, and Celia have lost argument.

    And poor Turley, dang this is going to punch a hole through his polygamy lawsuit.

  461. Speaking of attorneys reading the boards, Turley ought to be checkin it out, this is going to put the nasty on his lawsuit.

    Talk about bad timing. Kody not a good prophet either?

  462. Its not the place probably for personal chatter, but I asked about your health on this recent trip. Had heard you had a turn and we wouldn’t want Warren thinking he had caused it. A good reason to stay in good health or over come illness and injury, to not allow Warren to claim it as God’s hand!

    I dare not speak of any of my injuries or they too will become WSJ prophesy fulfilled.

    Obviously you do email now! Can you forward your email to the Creedbed Road contact or can I ask him to forward my email to you? Not sure its a good idea here.

    I think the dismantling of the Grain silo’s was the last adventure I had with you! I am still remarking about the kid driving the backhoe in town, I thought he was 8 or 9 years old, you said he was younger!

    I spoke to Creedbed today about Wisan/UEP stuff. At some remote level I think about getting involved again, but don’t really have the time or money. One side of me would love to buy a house or property out there, but I realy prefer greener places. But good memories are still there. Don Cox very dry sense of humor a great memory. Would of liked to been there when Seth spouted out, only heard about it after. You have some really great activist around you! The 1987 MOLE, (S.C.), the secret papers Don was selected to find! I think you out did SC, but both of you had guts!

    I am not drawn to the land only the people, but I would just piss off half of them or more. Couldn’t piss off as many as you though, he…he…

  463. ill bill still spouting off it seems eh?

    Too bad Warren didnt defend himself properly, all his wives being virgins and all.

    A poster on the dizzy news pointed out that Jeffs has no remorse and would get back to it if he had the chance, using this freedom of religion Chruch.

  464. Proud Texan said this on August 3, 2011 at 10:11 PM

    Its been a spell since I locked horns with Bill, whats his web page site, I feel like gloating today…..


  466. My favorite trial comment so far …

    #warrenjeffs prosecutor says giving Jeffs too much time during his silences “unfruitful.” judge: “I’m used to a lot unfruitful exercises”

    texasconnie said this on August 3, 2011 at 9:22 PM

    We needed some laughs this afternoon/evening. That was just painful.

  467. Good to see a lot of familiar “faces” posting. I posted as “blueneck” on the trib and gosanangelo boars in the past. Have been keeping up with the prosecutions, but other online and offline obligations have kept me from posting much. As a West Texan, I can assure you that the jury is going to be very hard on Warren Jeffs. I often wonder what happened to duane and to John Lester. duane was an idjit and lester was a nut. I turned lester in to LE (indirectly, emailed someone who knew someone, etc) for the nasty threats he made about Flora Jessop on the trib blog. I took his threats seriously.

  468. I have trouble spelling too 🙂 and typing, blah

  469. Lester was so outrageous he drew a lot of people together and we tag teamed him, he was the gopher and yes the name of the game was Pop the Gopher

  470. Texas juries are proving to be the pros at that game however, and I salute them!

    Thanks for your service! This last must have been a tough one to endure. Good ending expected.

  471. Yep, feels good to shed the nick names, can’t remember all the passwords any way. Brooke banned me for life for being extreme and I was! Brooke in the beginning got her leeds from Flora and I, I kept the emails! We got into it over the HOPE Organization battle, they used a news clipping on their web page and the TRIB threatened to sue them over it. It was really Brooke going pro FLDS in her leaning. Whitehurst seems to know nothing of that battle. Brooke was black listed by several activist after the spat.

    Ben Winslow was always a good guy! I started with Robert Gehrke, he was Trib, AP, then Trib again! He moved to washington DC Area. August of 2000 we linked up. He was on his computer late and at 2 in the morning, we would chatter and share research. Robert was before Dobner and a dozen other AP reporters.

    Dougherty came in later, a group of lawyers met with Flora for 3 hours before allowing John to write his first piece. They were qualifying the authenticity of the group. Dougherty also drove to California and spent a day with me! It was a good cooperation, but we often argued about his scoop, he was protecting him being first to release a story and we were more concerned with the issue and keeping the AG in the loop. AG’s didn’t do what we hoped for, but they were kept in the loop.

    I looked at Bill’s site, but no contact info, a one way posting. I twittered him I think, but don’t really twitter, so I might of screwed that up.

    I use to get lots of implied threats, polygamous types that were independent and feared what exposure of the FLDS issues would bring.

    I think a head on with Mad Bill would be good now. The ground beneath him is crumbling and if he gets threatening now, he to could face an investigation and trial. Some of his rants got close to threatening a judge and I think he might actually find comfort in being in a Texas jail close to Warren, martyrs forever together.

  472. I think Warren ended up with sanctions over the 3rd Recusal with threats to Judge Walther, but not sure what the sanctions are.

  473. Was Lester the guy trying to get a poktgamy museum? I was into all of this in 2008, but let it go. I need to remind me of the players, a senior moment! One had a pro polygamy blog and that gave me several hundred emails a month, I eventually dropped that and purged a thousand emails. The grouped argued theoretical polygamy, might of been Lester, I can’t remember.

    The Polygamy museum guy was also double posting, he wanted Utah to fund a museum. I get guys on FaceBook now who sound familiar, but I can’t place them, I wonder if they are from this issue. I have no time for FaceBook, but started a page in a low activity period.

    There was a time when I was concerned about Identity, but a cyber stalker that followed my daughter for 4 years, me for 3 years and is still in the picture, involved the Los Angeles County DA Cyber Investigators and they determined in 5 minutes I could not hide from any one, to vocal on the world wide web, so WHY TRY NOW! Rowenna Erickson at Tapestry Against Polygamy coached me years ago on fear and getting involved, she was largely RIGHT!

    Speaking of the Tanners on this site, many of us found Sandra & Jerald with LIGHTHOUSE MINISTRIES and shared the polygamy history, sadly Jerald passed several years back. The Tanners were like Ben Bistline, they had documented enough to need not fear a lawsuit by the FLDS. What revelations we had discovered as outsiders, they had copyrighted and published years before. When Rodney Parker threatened me with FLDS slander in 2001, it was nothing that Ben had not already published. The FLDS theology books were even better insurance, they were copyrighted FLDS statements of facts. Slander is useless with the text books in hand, same for all of Warren’s audio’s.

  474. I did read where Warren would bear the cost of the state to defend his third frivolous attempt.

    This is has been a long trail, I think the beginning of the end was the breakup over one man rule, that allowed the craziness to go unhindered, and then who would have guessed, you soon got someone completely off the wall.

    I dont think Warren lasted three or was it four years before he was busted?

    Now that his game is toast I reckon someone else will fill the void.

    Hopefully the feds / state act properly with the UEP RE and prevent these abuses in the future.

    This left one hell of a tattoo on the govts of UT and AZ

  475. Looks like I was wrong when denying “heavenly sessions” were about sex. I seriously through reading the dictations that he was simply going into an semi state of consciousness to get revelations, like I sometmes do before going completely to sleep, where my wife informs me (and I remember some of them) of saying some of the craziest things. This guy has made a complete mockery over everything his followers believe he represents.

  476. At least what I sometimes say is usually comical and not religious.

  477. Rhodney Reck was the nut who wanted to fund the plygga museum,

    He is also the one who sued the Fed Board of Education for “An inadequate Edjumacation” lost the suit and lost on appeal – both were performed pro se, or acting as his own attorney.

    I dont know why he wasnt given the bill for those suits. I think he was told the joke, “Sue the school” and actually did it. Its online.

    Lester moved to SLC and was a self proclaimed forty year old virgin who wanted plig wives, oh they should be bisexual too in case he has a headache or… other performance issues.

    He had put up a website blog with lots of his crazy rants and threats. Kind of a younger version of ill bill, but without the colorful experience.

    The trib cut their word count way down on account of him, and alluded to his misbehavior in an article and he threatened to sue because he could tell they were talking about him.

    ha ha ha!

    And yeah, Brooke…. pffffffffffttttttt

  478. No lie on Rhodney


    “Reck states in his complaint that he was not provided an “adequate [or] satisfactory education.” No facts were set forth within the complaint to support this claim.

    The district court determined that Reck’s claims were without a legal basis in law.”


    Further, his plyggy museum and rants about intellectual property

  479. Lester is a hated spammer / mlm geek who has been in all sorts of idiot scams.

    He called the FBI on Pliggy – Alan Holm – as you might recall and as documented on pliggys web page.

    This after pliggy got on him for spamming his flds buddies with his mlm crap after they had just started communicating and lester feared getting blood atoned for spamming.

    he he he

    This is the kind of crap lester is in to in the past, I dont know if he ever got a real job

  480. I have been so visible on the internet under another nickname for years that I never worried about cyberstalkers. By the time people told me I shouldn’t be so public about who I am, it was too late 🙂 I have had a websites since around 1997-98 and have my name and address on them 🙂 My “real life” nicknames when I was younger were “Mongo”(“don’t shoot him, you’ll just make him mad”) and “Hulk”(“Hulk SMASH!”), so I never worried about physical assault 🙂 Several of the old posters knew my real name.

    Back on subject, at (which will probably be named something else sooner or later) ,
    they said that the it was JD Roundy that testified and that the procecitions did get to question hom before court was recessed.

  481. That should be “procecution” I told you I couldn’t type (or proofread either)

  482. The lawyer history began in Canada. I small attorney who was in it over his head. Vaughn Marshall stepped in with money and a team of lawyers, he asked for over kill and I sent him several hundred emails. I figured he would hollar UNCLE! He didn’t! He asked for ALL I had and got over a thousand emails. Canada had issues representing American victims and Flora & Linda found Joanne Suder, she took the ball and ran with the issue, seems like that was 2004 ish. Roger or Rodger Hoole followed and has been in this since.

    The theology books I touted mostly came from Dan Fischers little brother from an indirect path. I over used the hard back books until Krakauer stepped in. He got 10 of the 14 books I had while writing his book. He later forwarded them to Hoole. I lost IN LIGHT and TRUTH to the current Texas case, not sure why, I would of thought several were floating around. Flora and Vaughn got 3 of them. Last January on ebay I found 3 that an apostate was selling out of boundary county Idaho. A follower of Winston.

    I started collecting the audios in 2001 when Lenore was copying over them. They were of huge value and were distributed to NPR and groups like the Southern Poverty Law Center when the FLDS was studied. Steven Steed sold me my largest group which cost me $1,000. It was travelling money for an apostate on his way out and negociated on the TEXAS POLYGAMY BLOG.

    Can’t remember who I got the deposition from, but likely those involved in Stubbs vs Jeffs. Rulon in 1989 discussed at length the FLDS finances. Majestic Trust, the UEP etc.

  483. Jay Beswick you still make me smile. I hope all is well with you and yours.

    It has been a long road and you still never fail to amaze me. In a nice way.

    Do you think maybe… just maybe this one will take it all over the edge?

    Do you think we will ever really find out who and what has been involved all these years?

    Am sorry to hear about Ben Bistline. His book has been used for a lot of years and to this day still sits on my desk top for reference. He did a great service imo.

    For those asking about the Rebecca on the phone with Dr. Drew it sounded like Rebecca Kimbal. Not sure but it sure sounded like her. And Dr. Drew should have had her on for an hour to tell all whole story.

  484. Thanks once again to Matt Waller and Patrick Dove. 🙂 Photo # 4 is a keeper.

    Warren Steed Jeffs a mere mortal man who thought he could lead people to believe he was above the law has now taken a backseat.


    That photo is the one that should be shown worldwide. jmo

    I know that so many have said that they can’t act on anything with out proof but had Utah enforced the laws or even made an attempt there would have been so many innocent people that could have been spared.

  485. Yep, my gripe! What if? Utah & Arizona had done their job?

    Mike Watkiss in Wynn Jessops driveway, Nichole in the upstairs window, an armed militia in his drive way! Mike being told to leave, the MOHAVE county sheriff ignoring the request for help. Back then William Ekstrom Jr the Mohave County DA was useless and running interference. The DA wouldn’t return my calls, the County Supervisor Buster Johnson from August 23rd 2000 was right on and another bull in the china shop, the only county help then.

    I used a link with Suzan Mazur a journalist working on a Financial Times piece to interview Ekstrom, he wouldn’t give me the time of day, but loved to hear himself talk. I used his interview to qualify his position. Matt Smith whom replaced him has done well, but Ekstrom is still a Mohave county consultant.

    I looked into the Kathy Jo concern today, witnesses put it at a real climbing accident in their opinion. He was climbing near the Hurricane Cliffs. I’d rather believe something sinister, but those at the time who knew the area said it was a lack of experience. There are still some sources left to go to.

    My feeling now, is that Warren’s actions in representing himself will unravel his group, it will split and the courts will be very nervous about supporting a church led UEP trust, to much truth now exposed. I think Warren will be convicted, but even if not, he has stuck a dagger in to the heart of the FLDS faith. I expect the press will revisit Colorado City again, many have already.

    I would of watched in silence or semi silence, but Warren representing himself was to much to not take the day off and comment, to also reconnect with some. To go or be public if not already!

    I am hated or respected in CC. The library effort was my sisters program, she is in Kingman. I worked to suport it thinking it a good idea and knowing I could involve 2 of the UEP court appointed trustees who are also friends. Couldn’t have imagined they would burn the books and vandalize the building, but that is Warren’s influence. I met and asked for Jennifer Dobner on that press opt. It was right after the polygamy summit in 2008. I later went to Flagstaf to see my neice graduate from Northern Arizona University. It was 3 events in a row, I couldn’t simply aford the cost of the trip otherwise.

    I do have an interesting hope now, but am concerned about what Warren could order, if he offs himself that is his decision. He tried before and may try again, he says he will be translated, may be at his own hands. He could cheat the courts. He is whacked enough to think he is going to a better place, I hope none of his flock follow, but I am concerned!

  486. To all here a good night, I have 2 trips and 1,000 miles to rack up by Friday night late. No internet, but I will be on pins and needles wondering the courts outcome. Can’t put this off and need a little shut eye! Fall a sleep behind the wheel and it would be God punishing me at Warren’s orders!


  487. I used a link with Suzan Mazur a journalist working on a Financial Times piece to interview Ekstrom, he wouldn’t give me the time of day, but loved to hear himself talk. I used his interview to qualify his position. Matt Smith whom replaced him has done well, but Ekstrom is still a Mohave county consultant.
    I looked into the Kathy Jo concern today, witnesses put it at a real climbing accident in their opinion. He was climbing near the Hurricane Cliffs. I’d rather believe something sinister, but those at the time who knew the area said it was a lack of experience. There are still some sources left to go to.
    Many of those issues that you brought up with the Suzan Mazur link never really were addressed by any agency. Leaving many unanswered questions imo. You have so many things to back up all that was said it often made me wonder why the government agencies haven’t spoken out about such things. Who knows if we are lucky one of those talk shows will start looking at everything from that angle.

    Kathy Jo I thought said that her brother was looking forward to a new job. And I thought it had something to do with flying. If my memory serves me right there was also some type of connection with Nevada?? not really sure. Strange thing that the locals blacked out much of what was on the report given to Kathy Jo.

    Didn’t mean to interrupt anything. Just saw your name and read a few posts to make sure it was you and it most definitely is Jay Beswick. Jay you take care and keep sharing what you can. Really good to see you.

  488. A post question, some one just bought one of the Alta Academy books I had listed on ebay with 1 of the Jeffs audio’s, wondered if it was some one from here? San Angelo buyer! Doesn’t matter just curious!


  489. Maybe, with all the stuff due in the next few days…we could start page 3???

    I can only wonder what new antics will try Judge Walther’s partience tomorrow. More BoM? Another prayer attempt meeting? I’ll be watching/reading from work. My co workers wander in, periodically, to read over my shoulder. Several, who have worked sex crimes, are just amazed at this stuff!

  490. Jay, it’s interesting listening to you talk about your history of fighting against the flds. I’ve only known about them since 2008 but it’s obvious you and many others have been trying to help the victims/expose the abuse for a long time. And now it really looks like Jeffs will be convicted and probably sit in prison for along time. He finally got the showdown with the government he wanted, although I doubt it turned out the way he hoped. Congratulations to you and all the other fighters who won this battle. I hope this is the first big win in a long line of wins to come.

  491. My take on this trial is even with two convictions Warren S. Jeffs tries to remain in control of the FLDS Church, albeit Jeffs may experience a substantial ‘falling away’ he will fight to preserve his,”one Man Rule”. I agree with Stamp that this policy alone has probably caused most of this nightmare to transpire. The UEP Trust could ultimately remain in Court control or be dissolved but it won’t terminate Warren’s survival, even if he is behind jailhouse bars. The ‘scattered flock’ policy will likely continue and more enclaves have likely already been acquisitioned for more ‘Lands of Refuge’.

    I think Warren would whittle his flock down substantially in order to gain more absolute ‘One Man Rule’ control. Spreading out his followers to more remote locales, secured and controlled within these smaller gulags would be more disciplined and indoctrinated. ‘Zion Mission’ continues and more devout ‘Templebuilders’ are trained, delayed strategy but not a defeated or an ended effort. The newer gulags are not yet fully self-supporting and financial assistance is needed in order for them to survive, Warren knows this better than anyone and he can still muster the resources to make these ‘Lands of Refuge’ not only survive but rather thrive.

  492. I believe it will be more difficult for WSJ to maintain rigid control of the flock once he is convicted and put in a Texas penitentiary. He has supposedly used $23,000 worth of calling cards in the last 5 months. He will not be allowed that much telephone time once he’s out of county lock-up and in the pen.

    Of course, he could still have visitors shuffle papers in and out, but that time will be more limited as well.

    Maybe it will lead to him having another “I’m not the prophet, I never was the prophet” revelation in a weak moment.

    Whatever transpires, I’m sure he will hang on as tightly as he can, as long as he can. He’s definitely not the kind to cede even an ounce of control.

    BTW, I’m about half-way through Sam Brower’s book, Prophet’s Prey. It’s good — mostly stuff I’d already read here and there but nice to have it all placed in order and sourced.

  493. Please continue on “The Trial You’ve All Been Waiting For – Warren Jeffs #3″

    — Admin

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