FLDS Bigamous Marriages from 1989 – 2006


STATE’S EXHIBIT 992*

*Dozens upon dozens of bigamous marriages Warren performed either as mouth or witness.

Texas took the time to add the child bride marriages performed in Hildale, Utah and elsewhere.

Also there is a special row for Wendell Nielsen and Merril Jessop,  (see their initials) so this same document will likely be used at their trials as well.  This should be searchable, you can see where these guys were often marrying many women in a day – and haven’t seen any plural wives attending as Witness.

As someone mentioned on another thread, “So much for consent”.

Its a large file as there are a lot of marriages.

 

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~ by FLDS TEXAS on September 4, 2011.

153 Responses to “FLDS Bigamous Marriages from 1989 – 2006”

  1. This list not only shows the US FLDS bigamous marriages, it also shows the Canadian FLDS bigamous marriages.

  2. Page 20 Line 196 Leroy Sunderland Johnson? This is Uncle Roy.

    He is long past this life. Warren must have ( RE ) Married everyone.

    This is another way he assumed control of these peoples minds.. Woah

    There is no place he has not molested and affixed his monogram . I am Tired of this guy.

  3. I agree, that’s sicko. Uncle Roy died in 1986. Ada who was married to him in 2000 was previously married to Alma Timpson.

  4. Question : anybody know what happened to Wendell Nielsen ? Did he disappear into another “place of refuge ” ?

  5. I have heard that Wendell is currently staying with family members in Conifer, Colorado – a small community about 30 minutes due west of Denver on I-70, in the foothills of the Rocky Mountains.

  6. Wendell has had a “Drs Note” to delay his trial dates as I recall… I reckon at some point this will have to stop/

    Perhaps these “family members” were repenting from afar, now that Wendell has been kicked out he is repenting too.

    I was taken aback by all the child brides who had ceremonies in Hildale, UT.

    Wonder if they were held in Warren errr Rulon’s compound? Maybe he kept a baptismal font there too for honeymoons.

    And all those FLDS didnt know what was going on?

    SPARE ME

  7. Holm, Rodney Hans

    Stubbs, Ruth

    Warren Mouth – 1998

    WLN Witness

    Held in Hlldale, Washington CO Utah

    Fredrick M. Jessop and
    James K. Zitting other witnesses

    ————————-

    As I remember it, this Ruth was not so willing and was “poofed”

    no one knows where she is now.

  8. pg 44

    Roundy,Boyd

    9/20/2004

    Emily

    Needles, CA

    Warren Mouth

    Nathan Carter Jessop Yes
    Gayle Nielsen

    Yes 10/1/1987

    Wallace California Zitting
    Suzanne

    Lyle Steed Jeffs

    ===========================

    Lyle Jeffs was witness to 4 Bigamist marriages, including this child marriage on the same day, in Needles, CA.

    It was the last day of Summer, probably still pretty warm in Needles.

    Reckon they chose that town, because they wanted some new seamstresses and figured this would be a good way to imprint their life work on them?

  9. Note marriages also include such romantic places like

    R17 which is the Yearning for Zippers Ranch,

    Cedar City Utah,

    Mesquite NV,

    Kingman AZ

    Castle Rock CO

    El Paso Tx

    Short Creek AZ aka Colorado City along with Hildale

    Amerisuites Hotel, Denver CO

    Lake Powell – and Page AZ listed separately

    Exciting town of Parowan Utah

    Las Vegas hubba hubba!

    “Lee Steed’s haunted house in CO”

    Boulder City, NV

    ———————

    Of highly interesting note, Warren married two child brides to Jessop boys at YFZ on July 27 2006 and then 6 days later, three more bigamist marriages in Boulder City NV.

    Two weeks later, he was pulled over while leaving Las Vegas on his way back up I-15 on the way to Shortcreek.

    Driving that red Caddy would have raised eyebrows with the God Squad in the crick tho – I think by this time he was just doing “short” drive by’s to flip them the bird and dust his shoes at them as he hid behind tinted glass.

    Note, his last marriage to anyone in shortcreek area was in Dec 2005.

    Also of note, he married Lyle Jeffs in a bigamist marriage on 7-13-2006 in Vegas in a group of 5 marriages, this just about a month from his arrest.

    Isaac Jeffs was secondary witness to most of these later marriages, being the trusted valet, driver, and sidekick punk Warren groomed him to be.

    So he performed a bunch of Marriages in Vegas, back to YFZ, then back to the Vegas area for a total of 10 bigamy marriages in the weeks before his arrest, … and two of those were child brides.

  10. Stamp, you left out that he himself married the 12 year old on 7/27, then went off and married the 3 bigamist marriages on 8/3 and then returned to the YFZ to rape the 12 year old before he got arrested. Looks like he was trying to pack a lifetime of memories into a short time.

  11. Saw he married Raymond Jessop who got a child bride too just under the wire.

    What kind of genius would marry a child bride when your proffut was on the run?

    Oh that kind…

    Those guys werent thumbing their nose at the law, they were flipping the bird with both hands..

    Well, where are Raymond, Warren and friends today?

  12. Stamp, Ruth Stubbs has found love and is happily married – a REAL marriage, not a FAKE marriage like she had with Rod Holm.

    Ruth’s husband is from the Creek and their family lives in Southern Utah.

  13. I agree, that’s sicko. Uncle Roy died in 1986. Ada who was married to him in 2000 was previously married to Alma Timpson
    —————————————
    Maybe Uncle Roy was finally resurrected and they’re hiding him somewhere.

  14. “I was taken aback by all the child brides who had ceremonies in Hildale, UT.

    Wonder if they were held in Warren errr Rulon’s compound?”

    Yes.

  15. 3:22 was me.

  16. Says I’m logged in, but apparently not.

    texastwist

  17. I’m just now beginning to look closely at this exhibit.

    A couple of quick comments.

    Love the fact that WLN and FMJ have their own columns.

    Starting on 10-10-1998, Warren did not serve as a witness to any of the listed marriages; he was mouth.

    I would not be surprised if Rulon Jeffs never stood as mouth for any marriages after that date.

    Anyone know otherwise?

  18. Actually on the list, it goes back to 2-1998 before it shows Warren as Witness.

    Most of the listed marriages between that February and October were to Rulon.

    July 1998 is interesting. Warren was mouth for the marriage of three of his future wives to Rulon.

    Interesting, too, that two of those marriages were on July 22 — Warren’s anniversary date with Annette and also significant as the date (in 2004) when Warren married his first underage (14) girl in Texas.

    Lots of interesting information.

  19. texastwist, I think that Wendell and Merril have their own columns because this list will be used in their upcoming trials. Probably the sentencing phase, as prior bad acts.

  20. texastwist, it was in 1998 that Rulon had one of his more serious (debilitating) strokes. I guess that is when Warren took over the “marriage” ceremonies.

  21. That’s what I’m thinking, Anon, on both points.

    What I’m seeing in July 1998 (along with what is in Warren’s Phood Records) strongly supports the idea that Warren planned all along to marry some of his father’s wives after Rulon was dead. Warren selected those young women/girls to marry Rulon.

    So much for the notion that God spoke through the prophet as to marriages.

    There is an error on 4-23-2001. They have the wrong Allen Steed.

    Elissa Wall’s marriage was not bigamous. Underage, yes. Bigamous, no.

    Gotta like the inclusion of counties in “Location” for Hildale, Colorado City and Caliente.

    Lest anyone wonder about their jurisdictions.

  22. WSJ, may also have been drugging his father Rulon at this time, nobody knows only WSJ, so Rulon may not have been aware of this, probably ? The only thing I know is WSJ was drugging is father with heavy duty mind – altering MEDS . Maybe these marriages were some of those times he was being used by WSJ with drugs/meds .

  23. Good possibility.

    I’ve wondered myself about that and if maybe one or two of Rulon/Warren wives knew about it. Warren sent one of Rulon’s wives (an RN) out of state to California almost immediately after Rulon’s death. I’d have to pull up his exact phrasings, but Warren often spoke of that particular young “Mother (later his wife)” as if she was bordering on hysterical at times.

    I also can’t rule out that one or more of Rulon’s young wives may have used their sexuality to further manipulate him under Warren’s direction/suggestion. Becky Musser testified at one of the trials that she locked horns with Warren over giving Rulon a blow job.

    All things considered, Warren using one or more of Rulon’s wives in that manner (and others) to keep him controlled/addled/disoriented doesn’t seem out of the realm of possibilities.

    “Calculating” is a word I read today in a description of Warren. That’s hitting the nail on the head. (Apologies to the person who wrote it that I can’t recall who to give them their props.)

    For all of his skewed thinking when it comes to the “gentile” world and the court systems, his writings and most of actions with regard to the faithful demonstrate to me a person who will lay his foundation years in advance.

    I have to wonder if the one thing he did not count on was actually getting apprehended and tried.

  24. I think he had a good idea, at least after he exed the Barlows which almost started a little war and had cops crawling all over the place.

    The fact they generally left him alone probably emboldened him, yet he might have been feeling a little paranoid for a few reasons, hence the hidden hideout in Texas.

    I think he truly though that he could use that as home base and be free himself from worry of facing justice.

    It was his biggest mistake in all his prophetic calculations.

    That said, I cant imagine where he would have moved to be safer, unless you want to consider staying back home in shortcreek, where they usually do NOTHING about all these crimes.

  25. I wonder if he wouldn’t have been safer and stayed uncaught if he had remained in Short Creek. They sure as heck weren’t doing anything to capture him. It’s a given that his followers now in jail probably wouldn’t be if they hadn’t followed him to Texas.

  26. Yeah, all those marriages in UT, AZ NV and CA – and none of those states can get off the dime.

    Oh, Shurtleff rattles his saber, but he has to check in with Temple Square to see what they tell him first.

  27. Don’t forget that in Escape, Carolyn Jessop mentions a visit from darling favorite Naomi, where she told Carolyn that she and a bunch of Rulon’s “wives” “had endometriosis” according to Warren, and had been taking birth control pills as treatment…

  28. Well Naomi’s on something cuz she sure screwed around with Warren.

  29. A very long long time ago before all was revealed I was still trying to see if Warren could actually think of himself as a prophet whose care was for his flock and the issue that was difficult for me was the number of wives…. if in the FLDS version you have to have 3 to make it to a celestial god then marrying more than three meant that you were knowingly cutting off other priesthood men….

    I concluded:

    Warren was conducting his own lay away plan with the marriages of the young to Rulon

  30. WSJ, may also have been drugging his father Rulon at this time, nobody knows only WSJ, so Rulon may not have been aware of this, probably ? The only thing I know is WSJ was drugging is father with heavy duty mind – altering MEDS . Maybe these marriages were some of those times he was being used by WSJ with drugs/meds .

    Anonymous said this on September 6, 2011 at 1:05 AM

    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    What kind of mind altering medications ? Can someone supply the names of the specific medications ? Who prescribed these medications, or were these medications in fact illicit drugs ?

  31. Given his age and the strokes he had, I think it’s completely explainable as just ordinary dementia. No drugs needed.

  32. Heh BIB

    a while ago you posted a link to an article using Mormon records of marriages that tested a hypothesis on polygamous vs monogamous mating which showed that polygamous married women of the pioneer era had fewer children than monogamous married Mormons – which bore out the idea of stress and competition for resources.

    Could you repost the link?

    Thanks

  33. “Warren’s Phood Records” – good one Twist. Maybe that is why Warren hasn’t been eating in prison; he doesn’t have his “Phood Records”.

  34. HHG – let me check my files tonight and I will post it as soon as I can find it. The article concerned itself with genetic and evolutionary fitness as I recall.

  35. So presumably this document is one of the ones reviewed by Shurtleff when he claimed the evidence forwarded to him just didn’t give him any real Utah material?

  36. I guess it depends on when Shurtleff made that statement 3C. This document wasn’t released until August 10 at the earliest.

  37. BiB, there are 2 doctors named Barlow who apparently prescribe whatever is requested by the Profit. One of them is or was in Texas and his license needs to be revoked.

  38. “WSJ, may also have been drugging his father Rulon at this time, nobody knows only WSJ, so Rulon may not have been aware of this, probably ? The only thing I know is WSJ was drugging is father with heavy duty mind – altering MEDS . Maybe these marriages were some of those times he was being used by WSJ with drugs/meds .
    Anonymous said this on September 6, 2011 at 1:05 AM”

    —————–

    I believe this is true. WSJ used / manipulated his father unmercifully.

    WSJ also made sure his father had new young wives for an alternative reason; to keep him distracted (along with the drugs) when Rulon was lucid enough to demand his job back. No, it wasn’t just dementia.

    There is also speculation that WSJ did his father in (yes, murdered) at the very end. A few family members were allowed in his hospital room, but at one point WSJ went in alone, closed the door, and when he came out announced that his father had passed.

    I’m not the only one thinking these things.

  39. I can’t believe Dr. Lloyd Hammon Barlow’s Texas license wasn’t yanked after he was convicted of failure to report child sexual abuse. All he got was a fine and 8 hours of continuing ed.

  40. http://reg.tmb.state.tx.us/OnLineVerif/Phys_ReportVerif.asp?ID_NUM=512321&Type=LP&LicensePermit=M0988

  41. His license has not been removed. He completed the trainings and the exam by 10/20/2010.

  42. What can’t you believe 3C? He did what all the FLDS do, he lied and said it would never happen again. We all know it will happen everytime he is told to make it happen.

  43. Date of Birth: 1969

    Board Action (includes all actions regardless of license/permit type)
    View the documents containing action taken by the Board against this individual.

    Action Date: 10/20/2010
    Description: STATUS CLEARED 10/20/2010

    Action Date: 04/09/2010
    Description: ON APRIL 9, 2010, THE BOARD AND LLOYD HAMMON BARLOW, M.D., ENTERED INTO AN AGREED ORDER THAT REQUIRES DR. BARLOW TO PASS THE TEXAS MEDICAL JURISPRUDENCE EXAMINATION WITHIN THREE ATTEMPTS, WITHIN ONE YEAR; COMPLETE WITHIN ONE YEAR EIGHT HOURS OF CME IN MEDICAL RECORD-KEEPING AND EIGHT IN ETHICS; AND PAY AN ADMINISTRATIVE PENALTY OF $3,000. THE BOARD BASED ITS ACTION ON DR. BARLOW’S FAILURE TO USE DILIGENCE AND MAINTAIN ADEQUATE MEDICAL RECORDS.

  44. If you look at item 206 on page 21 you will notice that Dr. Barlow had his own underage bigamous marriage in 2001 right there in Hildale.

  45. Yep, that was one of the reasons cited during the Texas CPS matter in trying to keep his children away from him.

  46. I’m guessing that if all of his patients are in the FLDS, the real life problems resulting from failure to comply with regular medical practices are almost nil.

  47. “Phood Records”

    Among the funnier episodes contained in the Phood Records is a day when Warren had some folks being very careful with the Phood Records at YFZ as they were being moved. He did not want anyone seeing that the Phood Records and the Trainings existed in case anyone (The Pilot) was flying over at the time.

    He did not want anyone outside of a very small group of wives (and his mother) to even know that the Records and Trainings existed.

    Small wonder considering the damning evidence contained in them.

  48. “So presumably this document is one of the ones reviewed by Shurtleff when he claimed the evidence forwarded to him just didn’t give him any real Utah material?”

    Doubtful since this spreadsheet was prepared for his Texas trial.

    However, some of the Utah underage (and of course bigamous) marriages were documented in Warren’s Phood Records (dictations) which Shurtleff has had since at least February 2009.

    Taken from the Friend or Foe post:

    The documents (600 pages of Warren’s dictations) have found their way into the hands of Utah Attorney General Mark Shurtleff, who has been reading them with interest. …. ”It’s very cryptic and I’m not sure what it all means,” he told the Deseret News on Monday. … Asked if he had found any evidence of crimes, Shurtleff said: “no.”Link (February 10, 2009)

    “I haven’t received a lot of stuff that has Utah implications,” Shurtleff said. Link (April 4, 2009)

    Utah Attorney General Mark Shurtleff said in a recent interview with Fox 13 he has had no evidence presented to him of child bride marriages in Utah since 2004, when Utah made child bigamy a second-degree felony. Link (April 2011)

    That’s funny. I read many things in the Phood Records about the girls he married underage in Utah (after his father’s death) that were not “cryptic.”

    In fact, Warren was very clear about what he was doing.

    For example, from the Phood Record:

    Saturday, February 8, 2003

    “I then explained to him [Uncle Fred] that the Lord wanted me to go ahead and receive an underage wife, that we would take care of it this coming Sunday night.”

    “The Lord wants me to go forward without fear of the government. If I am brought into a controversy, then so be it..”

    Sunday, February 9, 2003
    Hildale, Utah (at the home of Rulon Jeffs/north house)

    “This event tonight of my receiving a wife for eternity who, according to through (sic) world’s view is an underage bride…”

    Warren Steed Jeffs and XXXXXXX Steed
    Sealed for Time an (sic) Eternity
    Uncle Fred as mouth
    Witnesses: Wendell Nielsen, Isaac S. Jeffs, Nephi S. Jeffs, and Joseph Steed

    XXXXXXX’s mother, Susanna Steed, and also Naomie Jeffs, and Ora Jeffs were present

    Naomie: “President Warren Jeffs took his new bride to meet the family, then sang to her and danced with her.”

    Warren had Naomie start working immediately (that night) with the girl who was 14 days past her 16th birthday.

    Warren: “I want to use her quickly.” [Okay, so maybe THAT was cryptic.]

    The following Sunday Warren had his new bride sit accompany him to General Meeting wearing her wedding dress and he made it a point to kiss her when she went through the handshaking line.

    The next day, Ora’s Testimony of what happened the night before is in the Phood Record. It involves “the all-consuming fire.”

    And so on.

    Warren did not even try to hide the marriage to that particular underage girl from his wives or even from the general faithful at the following Sunday General Meeting. Conversely, he wanted them to know what he was doing.

    Other underage marriages of Warren’s that took place in Hildale are in the record.

    The ages of the girls gets younger.

    Also non-cryptically documented in the Phood Records are some of the underage marriages performed by Warren in Hildale.

    “Asked if he had found any evidence of crimes, Shurtleff said: ‘no.” (February 10, 2009)

  49. According to one of Shurtleff’s quotes from above, Utah made child bigamy a second-degree felony in 2004.

    Warren married his first underage girl in Texas on July 22, 2004.

    March 1, 2004 was the date of the last time Warren married an underage girl in Utah.

    I’m gonna guess that the change in the Utah law took place after that date.

    Calculated.

    Perhaps this is the real reason Shurtleff has not brought charges against Warren for some of his Utah crimes.

    No bite in the Utah bigamy statute when those marriages took place in Hildale.

  50. This just in:

    State of Texas becomes first in union to identify those embracing a newly-identified Phood Group as a nutritional requirement. Participants in recent study describe experience as “really hot,” or, “an all-consuming fire.” Water should be kept on hand for those with sensitive tastebuds… and consciences…

  51. What was the legal age of marriage and/or consent in 2004 in Utah?

  52. Dunno, PT. I’m looking for that information.

    I believe the marriage age is 18. Unsure as to the age of consent.

    I’m also looking for the effective date of the statute that made child bigamy a second degree felony and whether it existed before or was a lesser felony or a misdemeanor.

    The 2004 child bigamy law makes it punishable up to fifteen years in prison for a bigamous marriage to a person under 18.

    Shurtleff has been widely quoted as saying he believes the Utah child bigamy law is responsible for the FLDS ceasing underage marriages in that state and I think he imay be right about that.

    Tom Green was convicted in 2001 on four counts of bigamy and one count of failure to pay child support.

    In 2002, he was convicted of child rape for impregnating his 13-year-old wife.

    He was paroled in 2007.

    The prosecutor in Tom Green’s cases was voted out of office.

  53. I used to think the ‘Heavenly Sessions’ were just Warren putting on an act of suffering until I read one record where he wanted his young girls to come in, but only if they weren’t on their period as he didn’t know what they Lord wanted them to go through. Vom!

  54. Utah marriage age — 18

    Minors over 15 — written permission of a parent or legal guardian

    15 — written authorization of a judge or court commissioner (is not specific or clear if this applies to minors under the age of 15)

  55. Here’s some Utah crimes for sure. No real bite in the punishment, though, for a third-degree felony.

    Title 30 Husband and Wife
    Chapter 1 Marriage
    Section 9.1 Parental consent to prohibited marriage of minor — Penalty.

    30-1-9.1. Parental consent to prohibited marriage of minor — Penalty.

    A parent or guardian who knowingly consents or allows a minor child to enter into a marriage prohibited by law is guilty of a third degree felony.

    Enacted by Chapter 129, 2001 General Session

    Here are the Utah felony punishments:

    Title 76 Utah Criminal Code
    Chapter 3 Punishments
    Section 203 Felony conviction — Indeterminate term of imprisonment.

    76-3-203. Felony conviction — Indeterminate term of imprisonment.

    A person who has been convicted of a felony may be sentenced to imprisonment for an indeterminate term as follows:

    (1) In the case of a felony of the first degree, unless the statute provides otherwise, for a term of not less than five years and which may be for life.

    (2) In the case of a felony of the second degree, unless the statute provides otherwise, for a term of not less than one year nor more than 15 years.

    (3) In the case of a felony of the third degree, unless the statute provides otherwise, for a term not to exceed five years.

    And a link to the Utah Code:

    http://le.utah.gov/~code/code.htm

  56. Just curious about some of the people after reading Flora’s book and Carolyn’s two books. Several assorted questions I’m hoping you all can help with…

    Is there a blog that is updated frequently with FLDS information?

    I read that Merril Jessop and Willie Jessop were both kicked out of the group this spring. Is that true? If so, what has happened to their wives and children?

    Are there still people living at the YFZ ranch or have they all been sent to Pringle?

    Is there a chart online of all the names and interlocking relationships?

    Is anything getting better for the children in the sister cities or the YFZ ranch?

  57. Utah Bigamy Code — Third degree felony

    Title 76 Utah Criminal Code
    Chapter 7 Offenses Against the Family
    Section 101 Bigamy — Defense.

    76-7-101. Bigamy — Defense.

    (1) A person is guilty of bigamy when, knowing he has a husband or wife or knowing the other person has a husband or wife, the person purports to marry another person or cohabits with another person.

    (2) Bigamy is a felony of the third degree.

    (3) It shall be a defense to bigamy that the accused reasonably believed he and the other person were legally eligible to remarry.

    Amended by Chapter 296, 1997 General Session

    Utah Child Bigamy Code — Second degree felony:

    Title 76 Utah Criminal Code
    Chapter 7 Offenses Against the Family
    Section 101.5 Child bigamy — Penalty.

    76-7-101.5. Child bigamy — Penalty.

    (1) An actor 18 years of age or older is guilty of child bigamy when, knowing he or she has a wife or husband, or knowing that a person under 18 years of age has a wife or husband, the actor carries out the following with the person who is under 18 years of age:
    (a) purports to marry the person who is under 18 years of age; or
    (b) cohabits with the person who is under 18 years of age.
    (2) A violation of Subsection (1) is a second degree felony.

    Enacted by Chapter 6, 2003 General Session

  58. Heh…

    Title 76 Utah Criminal Code
    Chapter 10 Offenses Against Public Health, Safety, Welfare, and Morals
    Section 1106 Duty of prosecuting attorney or law enforcement officer to prosecute offenses.

    76-10-1106. Duty of prosecuting attorney or law enforcement officer to prosecute offenses.

    All prosecuting attorneys, sheriffs, constables, and peace officers who have reasonable cause to believe any person has violated any provisions of this part shall diligently prosecute those persons.

    Amended by Chapter 118, 1990 General Session

  59. C/C, Merril and Willie were both kicked out in January. Willie’s wives and children went with him. Merril was let back in as a “caretaker” who looks after his family but cannot have sexual relations with his wives.

    Yes there are people still living at the YFZ and around the area. They are still spotted at WalMart and HEB frequently.

    No chart online with all of the names and interlocking relationships.

    It’s probably getting worse for the children since they are having to fast a lot.

  60. Proud Texan, thanks – as for your comment about the children having to fast a lot – I read on Flora’s twitter that the children have to fast when Warren fasts. But how do they know when Warren is fasting since his communication from jail is cut off?

    Also, I find it very hard to believe that Willie Jessop knows nothing about all the abuse. Has he been indicted? And… does anyone know when Wendel and Merril will be going to trial?

  61. “Merril was let back in as a “caretaker” who looks after his family but cannot have sexual relations with his wives.”

    No doubt his wives are grateful for the latter.

    Interesting that he is back in (of sorts.)

    Do you know if any of his sons are operating any of the businesses that were rolled into Phase-Tex?

  62. Utah age of consent — 16 if the other person is within ten years older. Otherwise, it is 18.

  63. I know that his son Rich was exed and Texan Service and Supply was taken over by Aaron Allred. Dan put his company in but immediately started a new Jack Daniel Corp with his 1/2 brother Parley as an officer. Parley is less than stable

  64. Is Danny boy in or out?

  65. I think in, but not totally sure with this latest move.

  66. I’m guessing that if all of his patients are in the FLDS, the real life problems resulting from failure to comply with regular medical practices are almost nil.

    Betty said this on September 6, 2011 at 12:31 PM

    Touche Betty, I agree!

  67. Saturday, February 8, 2003

    “I then explained to him [Uncle Fred] that the Lord wanted me to go ahead and receive an underage wife, that we would take care of it this coming Sunday night.”

    “The Lord wants me to go forward without fear of the government. If I am brought into a controversy, then so be it..”

    It sure looks like the defiant pedophile prophet got his wishes and was indeed “brought into a controversy” that landed him in prison for the rest of his life. I hope he is happy with what he accomplished.

    What a selfish thing he did to just get his “jollies off” with a little underage girl. Warren Jeffs is NOT a “man of God” by any stretch of the imagination. Warren Jeffs is nothing but a horny pedophile who is ONLY interested in himself.

  68. Twist, you quoted “Saturday, February 8, 2003

    “I then explained to him [Uncle Fred] that the Lord wanted me to go ahead and receive an underage wife, that we would take care of it this coming Sunday night.”

    “The Lord wants me to go forward without fear of the government. If I am brought into a controversy, then so be it..”

    Was this the child bride marriage of Merril Jessop’s underage daughter, Millie (that the Phoenix New Times reporter, John Dougherty, first disclosed) or was this a different underage child bride marriage Warren was bragging about to Uncle Fred?

  69. This just in:

    State of Texas becomes first in union to identify those embracing a newly-identified Phood Group as a nutritional requirement. Participants in recent study describe experience as “really hot,” or, “an all-consuming fire.” Water should be kept on hand for those with sensitive tastebuds… and consciences…

    gretchen said this on September 6, 2011 at 2:07 PM

    HA HA HA gretchen, thanks for my belly-laugh of the day!

  70. I read on Flora’s twitter that the children have to fast when Warren fasts. But how do they know when Warren is fasting since his communication from jail is cut off?
    Curious/Concerned said this on September 6, 2011 at 4:10 PM

    And how does Flora know when Warren and the children fast?

    She doesn’t know, but she still Tweets.

  71. Anonymous said this on September 6, 2011 at 11:50 PM: Was this the child bride marriage of Merril Jessop’s underage daughter, Millie (that the Phoenix New Times reporter, John Dougherty, first disclosed) or was this a different underage child bride marriage Warren was bragging about to Uncle Fred?

    Different child bride. This girl is a daughter of Joseph Steed and Susanna Roundy.

    Warren married Millie Jessop in 1999.

    1999 was the year he first married girls under 18 and he married several during that year, including Millie.

    Must have been his Millennial bug.

    In November, 2003 Warren married another daughter of Merril’s who was 13. He married her in Hildale. There is evidence in the Phood Recs that he also sexually assaulted her, but I’ve not seen anything at all that would indicate jurisdiction as to that crime.

    Warren’s “reasoning” for marrying that 13-year-old was that he had to marry her to save her from being destroyed by a wicked man.

    Seriously, he said that along with a good amount of “so be it” bravado.

  72. “…how do they know when Warren is fasting since his communication from jail is cut off?”

    Don’t think for a minute that Warren didn’t set out specific instructions for Lyle in the time between conviction and sentencing.

    What do you think that legal pad was for?

  73. That’s what I was thinking, TT. For all we know there is a set fasting schedule.

    So, to Anon @ 12:16, you don’t know that Flora doesn’t know, but you post.

    I don’t know if she knows, or if you know or don’t, but I do know it’s possible that she’s right.

  74. Since one of the offsite employers is reporting it, that’s a pretty good indication that it is true.

  75. I for one am slowly fasting

  76. I would like to be the first on record to call Mark Shurtliff A gutless immoral Pussy. Also for every minute of pain that the innocent suffer who exist within his domain I hereby transfer directly upon him and his family forever. Amen

  77. texastwist said this on September 7, 2011 at 1:00 AM: “In November, 2003 Warren married another daughter of Merril’s who was 13. He married her in Hildale. There is evidence in the Phood Recs that he also sexually assaulted her, but I’ve not seen anything at all that would indicate jurisdiction as to that crime.”

    According to this week’s Eldorado Success, this child bride is included in Merril’s Bad Acts.

    The girl had a miscarriage in July of 2006 when she was 16.

    She is a full sister to Naomie.

    Warren and Naomie were grooming her to be one of the trainers.

    Just two weeks prior to her miscarriage, Warren had her and two of her half-sisters join him and Naomie in Colorado to do some trainings at the houses of hiding. Three out of the four sisters (Merril’s) were married to Warren underage.

    Here are Warren’s exact words on why he had to “save” this girl by marrying her at 13:

    11-26-2003 Phood Record:

    “I was shown a dream Tuesday morning where I was about to take a trip and drive a car, and X, Merril Jessop’s daughter was to go with me, and instead of allowing her I set her in her own car to be alone to go her own pace, and I would not take her with me; and as I started out she tried to follow but her car went out of control and she was destroyed and killed, or harmed. As she lay there and I lay there in a heavenly session I looked up and there hovering over her on a cliff was the son of perdition himself, the dark wicked man, the devil himself guiding this wicked man ready to jump on her and destroy her fully.”

    “I also was shown awaking from this that if I didn’t receive X as a wife soon, the evil powers would destroy her. As I had been warned of the Lord and voiced to my scribe [Naomie] that she would be kidnapped and ravished and killed. Now the Lord impressed it upon me that since I knew this and if I did nothing, I would be responsible for her destruction. How is that for an emphasis.”

    “Then I revealed to Wendell [Nielsen] that the Lord wanted me to receive this thirteen-year-old bride and also for her deliverance as well as the Lord allowing this to be a reason in the government’s eyes to come stronger against this people. I explained the principle of the Lord cutting short His work in righteousness by me performing these works that would bring the wicked against us to justfy the Lord in destroying them, at a quicker pace. This is what cutting short His work in righteousness means, Him doing a righteous work. The wicked becoming angry, coming against us stronger and faster, bringing the judgments of God upon the wicked sooner, and this people cleaned up in the process. So the Lord revealed this to me.”

  78. Classic projection.

  79. Is there a picture of Warren Jeffs’ mother? Was she the lady who was on the tv interviews who looked so much like Warren? The lady who answered how the younger wives were especially treated well….

  80. I dont know if the younger wives were treated “well” – but its obvious they were groomed and then misled by sir bonehead warren.

    That this group let this guy rape children in that Temple bed (that they made for him) and the Baptismal Font is just fracking unbelievable – if you ask me that “Temple” was desecrated before the FBI ever showed up.

    Now the statue is going to look in the windows. CREEPY!

  81. …I always wonder just exactly how much “cleaned up” “this people” can ever possibly get..they already aren’t supposed to do a blessed thing except work and breed, seems like. They’re so repressed in every possible way, I often wonder how they can stand the boredom of their lives. The only thing I have come up with to withstand what sounds like an incredibly boring existence is the drama created by their refusal to abide by US laws. The tension of the many run-ins with LE keep them whispering and speculating inside their very own soap opera year after year.

    I wonder if they even use the restroom a wsj- prescribed way!!
    If wsj didn’t imagine it (in his often not-that-great use of grammar) then it just isn’t ok, it’s wicked, it’s bogus.. Lord, Lord, Lord… I can’t believe people endure this nonsense as they do. Practically killing themselves while their god zipped around in a red escalade, shorts, and of course, on the occasional harley…

    Man, I wish Naomie could be apprehended and thrown in women’s prison. She is one strange girl.

  82. an older anonymous said this on September 7, 2011 at 4:00 PM: “Is there a picture of Warren Jeffs’ mother? Was she the lady who was on the tv interviews who looked so much like Warren? The lady who answered how the younger wives were especially treated well….”

    I’ve seen two photographs of his mother. One from the 1994 Alta Academy yearbook page that Kathy Jo Nicholson had posted on her website and the other photo was one introduced into evidence at his trial. She was holding her newborn grandchild from the 15-year-old victim. The latter photo may be online somewhere and if I can find it, I’ll post a link to it.

    I haven’t been able to relocate the Alta photo online that Kathy Jo had posted.

    The woman you are thinking of is Warren’s half-sister, Janet (Norma’s.) She is/was married to Wendell Nielsen.

  83. thanks texastwist

  84. I often wonder how they can stand the boredom of their lives.
    ————————————
    We all know a picture never lies, unless it’s photoshopped.

    I don’t think boredom is the problem, they work their butts off all day long. I believe there is something much deeper than that consuming them.

    I was given the opportunity to view a folder of photos taken of the children at YFZ during the raid. It seemed to me that only one in twenty still looked happy and innocent. I took into consideration what they were experiencing at the time (the raid), and the fact that I might be too close to it, but I could see the sadness on those little faces wasn’t fresh.

    If you’re able to get a closer glimpse, you’ll see the ones who are standing it are the ones who have surrendered.

  85. Here is a photo of WJ’s mother.

    http://www.ksl.com/index.php?sid=1509137&nid=460&page=1#8

  86. Many kinds of work can be plenty boring. It depends on what it is. I’ve had several jobs at which I was extremely bored and depressed because they were things I had to do, not being able to get into a field I would have enjoyed. I put the best face on every time I had to go do jobs I hated, just needing a job. I wanted to quit many times, every day was depressing.

    I guess I am trying to say that there have to be lots of flds that have talents and interests that this repressive, cruel, strange culture would never abide.

  87. Wow, they let Mom attend something in Utah. Interesting. I think that is Nephi Steed Jeffs sitting beside her.

  88. Interesting perspective Sis. I hadn’t thought of it in those terms.

  89. Good photo of his mother. I hadn’t seen. Thanks for bringing it forward, 2morrow people.

    Interesting, too, because that was at the hearing to determine if his jailhouse “I am not the prophet” comments would be inadmissible.

    And as we know, the judge determined they would not be.

    Gotta wonder what might have been going through his mother’s mind as she heard what was said.

    No luck as yet of locating online the two photos of Merilyn I’ve seen.

  90. Surrender, resignation, acceptance.

    It is what it is and one day (the sooner the better) it (life and all of its sufferings, sorrows and pain) will all be over.

    When that is where a person is, rationality and logic don’t have a damn thing to do with anything.

    Been there. Done that.

  91. When the promise of salvation and a better life in the next life is the only hope one can believe in, it is all the more difficult for one to let go of it.

    Terror also comes in the form of the fear of falling.

    Free falling, as yehaaa named it.

  92. Texastwist –
    hear you loud and clear

    “When that is where a person is, rationality and logic don’t have a damn thing to do with anything.

    Been there. Done that.”

    me too, but not with respect to polygamy but other issues…

    Glad you are not there now.

  93. I hear ya, too, hhg.

    One thing I can’t imagine is an entire lifetime in that place. My residence there was relatively brief when I consider those who have spent a lifetime in it.

    Funny, though, is that it’s almost too easy to forget how strong a grip the terrors can have.

    Is a good thing, but not when I fail to fully remember that is the place where others may presently be.

    Patience, love and understanding.

  94. Lest there be any misconceptions or misconstruals, my time of living in hell was not related to polygamy, but it was not unlike the abuses that can come with it.

  95. Cannot begin to imagine a mother having to see what her son has done. Surely one of her children who is not under the spell of Warren has told her of his evil, the taped confession of his not being the real prophet and his sins against others. Mothers tend to blame themselves for the sins of their children. You know….the old “where did I go wrong – how did I fail him?” thing. Wonder if she heard the horrible tapes of the deflowering.

  96. Yes, older Anon, I wonder that too. Does anyone know how old she is and how young she married Rulon?

  97. So Warren’s mommy is still kickin around listening to all the news.

    She must be so proud.

    Her son has gone so far, now its time for him to have a really long rest.

  98. Here is the picture of Warren’s mother, Merilyn Steed Jeffs “holding her newborn grandchild from the 15-year-old victim”……

    http://www.sltrib.com/csp/cms/sites/dt.common.streams.StreamServer.cls?STREAMOID=LiwtsnHeLe6JjPbdHX1y3M$daE2N3K4ZzOUsqbU5sYvoct84YagsuzXjDJeud3ArWCsjLu883Ygn4B49Lvm9bPe2QeMKQdVeZmXF$9l$4uCZ8QDXhaHEp3rvzXRJFdy0KqPHLoMevcTLo3h8xh70Y6N_U_CryOsw6FTOdKL_jpQ-&CONTENTTYPE=image/jpeg

  99. Thanks, E. Texas.

    Warren’s mother Merilyn is 77 years of age — born in 1934.

    She was 16 when she married Rulon in 1951.

    She was his fourth wife in polygamy, his first first wife (Zola Brown) having divorced him over the issue.

  100. There is no way wsj’s mother did not know at all that she had given birth to a boy with some unusual behaviors and habits, by the time he was several years old, and probably even just a couple years old. If Rulon knew things, so did she. I personally see flds as a cruel system that rewards the strong and cruel and penalizes the more timid and “weak.” I suspect wsj’s mother is neither timid nor “weak.”

    I doubt she could have known all of it- but we have heard tell that Rulon called wsj on the carpet at times. Even if the mother didn’t know about the many sexual “escapades” of her son, she HAD to know about his many expulsions of decent men, break-ups of families, re-assignments, etc. These expulsions had to be common knowledge within flds, as they involved so many men and women that this mother probably knew personally, as old as she is, a life-long and prominent flds member herself. She had to know of the many re-assignments.

    I theorize that wsj got some of his ambition and coldness from mommy dearest. I say that because, in spite of the mistakes my two kids have made in life, there is lots of good in both of them. It’s because I have been tireless in loving them and teaching them. They are far from perfect but thank God, have much good in them. I do not stand for wrong behavior, once I hear of it.
    And when I realize my own mistakes, I talk with them and apologize clearly.I still point out things to them when I think there is a need for improvement, cry with them sometimes, lecture them, and laugh A LOT with them. They are mid-twenties and I am in my fifties. I have told both of them many times, in a nutshell, to do whatever they can to be decent to their fellow man.

    Seems to me that some people REALLY fell down on the job who influenced wsj. He had too many years of weirdness and cruelty going on, with too many different people and situations, for those who knew him best to say they knew nothing. I just don’t buy that. He could have been called on the carpet many times by lots more people as he grew up and “matured,” and they could have abandoned their loyalty to him, and even gone to police, tried to form committees to confront him, etc. Yes, in the end, wsj did the deeds and will do the time, but his mother should hang her head in shame until she breathes her last.

  101. How do you suppose she felt when the day after Rulon died, Warren announced the “hands off his fathers wives”?

    or the love hate relationship Warren must have had for his father that he would make such a statement AND follow thru with marrying some of those wives.

    Rulon had his secrets and Warren imo witnessed many of them.

    Walton

  102. an older anonymous said this on September 8, 2011 at 10:02 AM: “…the taped confession of his not being the real prophet and his sins against others….”

    Interesting question if Merilyn heard the “I am not the prophet/wickedest man on earth” tape.

    The photo that 2morrowpeople linked to was taken at a hearing in St. George over the tape’s admissibility, so I’m wondering if she might have heard his moments-of-clarity admissions and confessions.

    I doubt that she has heard the rape training tapes, although it is possible.

    Lyle wouldn’t even stay in the courtroom when evidence against Warren was being presented (it was none of his business…) I was told he did manage to get trapped in the courtroom during closing arguments of the guilt phase, so he had to hear what was on the tapes and other things he didn’t want to hear.

    According to the Phood Records, Merilyn handled/handles a great deal of administrative work for Warren, including archiving of the Phood Records. But when it came to the more intimate/noxious/pornographic/criminally damaging “trainings,” he was very particular that only less-than-a-handful of his wives were the ones who transcribed and secured them.

    His use of coded language in some of the ordinances makes it fairly easy to believe they are benign unless one gets the codes; when she read them she wouldn’t necessarily get a full understanding of what they were.

    Even one or two of his more favored wives (Ora and Patricia) lost Warren’s trust to some degree over the handling and security of the records.

    Warren knew damn well that his records could send him away forever.

  103. There is no question that his mother was well aware that many of his young wives were underage.

  104. an older anonymous said this on September 8, 2011 at 10:02 AM: “Surely one of her children who is not under the spell of Warren has told her of his evil…”

    Most of her children are solid with Warren and the Phood.

    LeRoy — First born, kicked out by Warren in 2005 and is now returned as an eunuch. According to Warren, Merilyn was very worried when LeRoy lost his priesthood and from his writings it is pretty clear she and Warren discussed LeRoy and his status on occasions. The thought of LeRoy can sometimes strike terror in Warren. He fears LeRoy could take his place and is better liked.

    Warren

    Lyle — ’nuff said.

    Melanie — Married to Wendell Nielsen, so who knows what her current situation is.

    Nora — Married to the faithful-to-his-own-detriment Allen Keate.

    Nephi — WSJ lackey.

    Ephriam — I don’t know if he is solidly in the WSJ camp or not. I’m not certain, but I think Warren may have “handled” him a time or two. I can say he is not one of the brothers who are very close to Warren. He is a twin to Rachel.

    Rachel — Here it gets interesting. She was married first to Ron Rohbock and then to Wendell Nielsen. According to the record, she was very upset when Rohbock’s phood was taken from him. She was raised more by Rulon’s wife Sharon Hammond than by Merilyn. I suspect she has suffered a great amount of damage done to her by Warren.

    Seth — Second or third tier WSJ lackey.

    Isaac — Numero Uno lackey.

    Enoch — The youngest and the “bad boy,” Warren despises him and shows indications that he was a sexual rival with regards to the younger girls (he is 22 years younger than Warren.) There was a pretty funny incident in Caliente when Enoch, Merril’s daughter “Mother Rose” and some others “defiled” the very room at the motel that was used by Warren to perform marriages. Warren was pissed off about it and ordered Merril to sell the motel.

    I couldn’t help but admire their style. :)

  105. I think Enoch is out.

  106. I still think about a previous post where someone had a talk with someone in the Creek. Who after hearing what all he did said something to the effect of, “well, if he wrote it down then it must have been alright for him to do it.” Sorry couldn’t find it to repost, but, it still haunts me.

    I am betting his mother and others probably have the same belief. Obvious from his trial he does, in my mind, believe God speaks to him and tells him it is OK to do these horrible things to little girls. I don’t think he is scam artist. A scam artist would not take it to the extreme he did. I think he really is a very sick man with a penchant for little girls/boys who lived in an environment that allowed him to develop his sick behaviors without the normal parameters the rest of us live within.

    I don’t think he or any of them ever believed the Phood records would ever reach the general public. Which is understandable on those locked in the temple. But, he should have known better than to have them in the red caddy with him.

  107. When the promise of salvation and a better life in the next life is the only hope one can believe in, it is all the more difficult for one to let go of it.
    ——————————————-
    But when you grow up in CC, and the brainwashing doesn’t take, all you can think is ‘how much worse can it be, really’? In hell, I mean.

  108. Thanks for posting the pics of Jeff’s mother. Interesting how she is never mentioned.

  109. Another interesting thought – after the big funeral for Merrill Jessop’s wife Fonetta that he had sent away, then his favorite wife Barbara dies and there is no word of a funeral at all for her. How come?

  110. Don’t try to figure out logic for the flds sheeple, henchmen, etc, you can’t, they don’t use logic, if they do it’s sparingly…….

  111. Barbara had a funeral in the Crick and then they drove her body back to the ranch for burial. There was National Geographic coverage going on at that time, so thats why you haven’t really heard anything about it.

  112. Carolyn Jessop writes about Barbara Jessop’s funeral in her new book.

    One of Warren Jeffs sisters is in Banking On Heaven. She doesn’t have very nice things to say about him.

    Does anyone know if the “compound” in Pringle is the new place people are being sent – like they were sent to the YFZ Ranch?

  113. “Then I revealed to Wendell [Nielsen] that the Lord wanted me to receive this thirteen-year-old bride and also for her deliverance as well as the Lord allowing this to be a reason in the government’s eyes to come stronger against this people. I explained the principle of the Lord cutting short His work in righteousness by me performing these works that would bring the wicked against us to justfy the Lord in destroying them, at a quicker pace. This is what cutting short His work in righteousness means, Him doing a righteous work. The wicked becoming angry, coming against us stronger and faster, bringing the judgments of God upon the wicked sooner, and this people cleaned up in the process. So the Lord revealed this to me.”

    ————————————

    When God was asked recently if a prison sentence for Warren was what He wanted, He replied “Warren who?”

  114. Mouse: Good thing I was not drinking anything when I read your comment. Might have lost a keyboard. Thanks for the laugh.

  115. Same here, chemist.

  116. Someone said Dr. Drew expressed the opinion to Brent Jeffs that wsj would have been a perv regardless of environment. I’m pretty sure I agree- the flds situation definitely makes this kind of thing more likely…but anyway, mature adults in his circle that knew he had a problem should have figured out a way to act against him before all this happened, if they were decent themselves. Banding together could have done something to slow him down and apprehend him much sooner. I don’t think this had to go on for so long. This stuff seems to thrive much longer out there in 1.mormonland, and 2. in those wide-open spaces. There’s no way this kind of stuff would be this bad in an easier-to-police area. wsj got away with stuff because he figured out how to constantly manipulate, and has used the power of religious beliefs to gratify his debauchery. He is cunning enough to know where laws and law enforcement is slacker than it ought to be.There have been many others doing the same, we all know about other situations. Each “religious perv” uses the situations they are provided with, or help to create, to commit their crimes.

  117. Watergirl said this on September 8, 2011 at 12:53 PM: “…he should have known better than to have them in the red caddy with him.”

    He had the audiotapes with him because he used them as part of the trainings. He would require selected wives listen to them before he had them participate in the acts. My guess is that he could test their reactions and get a gauge on whether they were “ready” for the next step and if not, how much other pressure he would then apply to the wife.

    I believe Naomie had the tapes stashed where they thought they would not be found in the event they were ever stopped and searched.

    I think he probably listened to them himself to enhance his more private “heavenly sessions” with the Quorum of None and the Quorum of One.

    Quorum of One being Naomie.

  118. TT- I for one really wanna see the inimitable Naomi imprisoned. She’s a real embarrassment to the female persuasion.

  119. “wsj got away with stuff because he figured out how to constantly manipulate, and has used the power of religious beliefs to gratify his debauchery.”

    gretchen said this on September 8, 2011 at 5:11 PM

    Well said, gretchen. Your choice of the word “debauchery” is just perfect!

  120. I want to see Naomi as well as the midwife and doctor imprisoned. However, how old is Naomi and how young did she marry Rulon?

  121. My guess is Naomi is around my age – 42.

  122. Don’t you think he had them with him because they turned him on?

  123. Noami is 37 and she married Rulon when she was 19.

  124. Yes, Betty, I most certainly do. It’s like serial rapist/murderers who keep souvenirs and they get off on them year after year.

  125. Does any one know where Naomi is?

  126. Yes, that too, Betty.

    For those Quorum of None times — no wife necessary.

  127. I kind of chuckle at the nonsense displayed in the second post here and that is the comment regarding LSJ being married. Surely the poster MUST realize that a man as important to the people as LSJ would have posterity named after him??? hmm… Drama, Drama, Drama.

  128. And named after him, and named after him, and named after him, etc….

  129. Anon @8:55, that’s not someone named after him, that’s him.

  130. But PT, Uncle Roy died in 1986. Was it a posthumous sealing?

  131. I see there’s a marriage date for LSJ to Sarah Elizabeth Barlow in 1938 listed on the exhibit, but I can’t confirm that date from my own records, not that this necessarily means anything.

    You guys all know you can be sealed in a non-marriage setting, right? A child to a father/mother, etc. Even JS and BY had some folks sealed to them as adoptees (as did my one of my grandpas when he had one of his wive’s nieces sealed to him posthumously because she died young and her parents had stopped practicing mormonism.

  132. You guys all know you can be sealed in a non-marriage setting, right?
    Third Cousin said this on September 10, 2011 at 10:51 PM

    Actually, Third Cousin, I think that many people on this blog find the concept that you “can be sealed in a non-marriage setting” to be quite foreign and rather bizarre.

  133. Wow, Anon. If that is the case I will research and try to provide articles and information. Chemist should be helpful in this regard as well. A sealing theoretically cements humans together in the family setting, but there can be other contexts rather than marriage or concubines. You can be sealed to a father and mother if you are adopted, you can be sealed to a stepfather (with no marital or sexual ties), and if your mormon parents married and begat you but not “under the covenant” (not married in the temple until later) you can be sealed to them in the temple without being dead.

    That said, the FLDS may not be practicing “sealings” in this context, but I assure you it has been done since the time of Joseph Smith and Brigham (Bring ‘em young) Young.

    I will research and appreciate any help. I could certainly be wrong.

  134. Third Cousin, I realize that you and chemist understand what the Mormon doctrine of “sealing” means. Nonetheless, (as far as I know) it is a concept unique to Mormonism.

    I feel that most people on this blog have not been exposed to this concept, since it is something quite foreign to religions other than those derived from Joseph Smiths’ doctrines.

  135. Thanks Anon, and I have never heard of the concept of “sealing” outside of any kind of mormonism. I agree it’s unique. I just want folks to understand that there are contexts for sealing outside of a sexual or wife relationship. Again, only as I’ve understood the concept all my life. I’m grateful that this issue has been brought out, as I simply assumed that my fellow bloggers knew of the multiple contexts of sealings.

    I’d appreciate everyone’s perspectives and what they were raised to believe about sealings. I may have been under the mistaken impression that many of us here have fundy and/or mormon ties.

  136. But PT, Uncle Roy died in 1986. Was it a posthumous sealing?

    Third Cousin said this on September 10, 2011 at 10:45 PM

    Not PT, but I can answer that question.

    Yes, it was.

    Sealing by proxy.

    Rulon Jeffs’ sister Leona Jeffs Allred was sealed to him by proxy after his death.

    Warren’s wife Esther Jessop Barlow (former wife of Arthur Leon Barlow) was sealed to Warren for time only and told she would be sealed by proxy to Rulon (who was of course, dead.) I don’t know if that ever happened since she was not controlling her oldest son enough to suit Warren.

    I think he used the promise of a proxy sealing to Rulon for Esther as a means to manipulate her.

  137. 7:03 am was me.

    texastwist

  138. A correction…

    Leona died in 1998.

    She was sealed to Rulon by proxy, but I don’t know the time frame for certain.

  139. I don’t find the concept of sealings outside of a marriage concept “foreign” at all, relatively speaking.

    Not being LDS or anything like it, the entire concept of “sealing” is foreign to me.

    Leona was sealed to Rulon because otherwise she had no one to take her beyond the veil since she was never resealed in marriage after she left Rulon Clark Allred due to the AUB split.

    I’ve never thought that her sealing to her brother meant there was “a marriage” between them in any shape or form.

  140. Those who know, correct me if I’m wrong…

    Isn’t the ongoing practice of sealing ancestors by members of the “mainstream” Mormon church essentially what y’all mean by sealings outside of a marriage?

  141. A few LDS aericles on sealing.

    http://lds.org/church/temples/why-we-build-temples/what-happens-in-temples?lang=eng&query=sealing

    http://lds.org/ensign/1982/05/the-first-and-the-last-words?lang=eng&query=sealing

    http://lds.org/general-conference/1975/10/family-research?lang=eng&query=sealing

  142. Spouses can be sealed to each other and children can be sealed to their parents. Adopted children can be sealed to their adoptive parents. Siblings are not sealed to each other, they are sealed to their parents.

  143. I am sealing myself to Pellman’s cheesecake, nicely warmed cherry crumb pie, and also nicely warmed peach crumb pie. Somebody has to take them through the veil.

  144. and who cares if I’m not a guy?-surely the BOM, or D+C, whatever, are due for yet another little alteration, another little tweak, update, what-have-you, right?

    So I hereby move that…..you know the routine, “God is telling me to take more and more of these dainty young morsels…”

  145. As I understand it, Uncle Fred was the proxy for Uncle Roy in the marriage to Ada Rae Barlow. I can only surmise that since she was married to Alma Timpson she was afraid she would go to hell since they believed he no longer held the priesthood and so she requested it.

  146. Thanks for the articles and info, chemist.

  147. You are welcome, TC

  148. Yes, thank you, chemist.

  149. I got caught up on my education of proxy baptism when I lived in SLC and these articles started coming out where LDS was baptizing Holocaust victims:

    http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/news/50205598-78/jewish-holocaust-lds-church.html.csp

  150. Does anyone know if Lyle has any underage marriages? (I don’t want to take the time to look it up)

  151. Love that avatar, Wild Thang

  152. Now I might introduce dozens and dozens of .witnesses to prove that Joseph Smith had nothing to do with it. If Joseph Smith secretly taught prac- .ticed or endorsed the doctrine of polygamy he did it con- . In quoting from The Mysteries of Mormonism by an Apos- .tles Wife Mister Evans reveals the character of his dozens and doz- .ens of witnesses. The reader will perceive that he depends largely on .the most bitter anti- Mormons and apostates for his evidence .but in quoting from The Mysteries of Mormonism by an Apostles .Wife he certainly reaches the chmax of this base testimony. In it he is called a lusty toper the worst of .a bad breed an ignorant brutal loafer immoral false and fraudu- .lent and the author says this is the man who founded what he dared .to call a faith and grafted on the United States the religion of licentious- .ness and bodily lust known as Mormonism. An apology is perhaps .due for even referring to this matter but since Mister ? vans makes this .work one of the chief of his dozens and dozens of witnesses I feel that .he should be expo.sed.

  153. WildThangFromCC, Lyle had at least 2 underage marriages. Mable who was his 4th wife was 16 when he married her in Hildale and Maegan Michelle Black who was 15 when he married her at Lake Powell, AZ.

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