Open Discussion #23

Continued from Open Discussion #22

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~ by FLDS TEXAS on January 10, 2010.

558 Responses to “Open Discussion #23”

  1. I dunno whether that pic above looks more like a bandaid on his nose or buzzard poop. I bet it was the latter and he’d licked the rest of it clean off like a lizard, because of his smile. Someone maybe told him it was a cure for reptile dysfunction?

  2. Good one, Stamp. Polygamist Gangsta Rap is the funniest thing I’ve ever seen on YouTube. Pretty bad language and very R rated, but funny none the less. The folks at National Banana are really twisted.

  3. Good find Stamp. Except the imbed now has WSJ’s creepy face on the page.

    I also had to go check out Polygamist Gangsta rap. Too funny.

  4. National Banana – Dot COM!

    Hey the whole wide world is onto these phonies now!

    Dang Internets!

    And yeah! Thats buzzard poop!

  5. YO, YO! YO!

    Ma Names Warren J

    I’m a P.I.M.P.

    I got more kids

    Than Angelina Jolie!

  6. The language is a little much, but it gets the point across.

  7. Polyg-a-ME

    Polyg-a-YOU

    Cracking up

  8. Heah Stamp how come Warrant has on a green inmate suit? Is that photo from another prison visit or is that just the seasonal Christmas costume?

  9. That green suit was the week they let Warren play “ELF”

  10. That ‘sELFish’ costume looks great, wonder how he’d look in red in time for Valentines Day?

  11. Cowboys Won last night!!! whoooo Hoooooo!! Love the video by the way :)

  12. cupcake over at mudpuppy’s blog keeps talking about the flds being a minority. exactly what minority is she talking about. they are white and unless the hispanics have got a few more, white is still the majority in texas.

  13. Another article for your enjoyment. You thought Warren was in control. Actually, Uncle Rulon is still being sealed to wives, still having children, and is the one directing who should be kicked out of the FLDS. Check out the new article at: http://flds101.blogspot.com/2010/01/flds-beliefs-101-rulon-jeffs-renewed.html

  14. My FLDS 101, you are very productive !
    Thanks for all your labor

  15. cupcake over at mudpuppy’s blog keeps talking about the flds being a minority. exactly what minority is she talking about. they are white and unless the hispanics have got a few more, white is still the majority in texas.

    ……………………………
    Tell her not to worry, according to Warren, soon our country is going to be “swept clean” of all the evil Gentiles, then the FLDS will be the majority and they can stop whining.

  16. somehow, I think they will still manage to whine.

    Betty

  17. I think it’s one of their religious precepts — whining, that is. I guess you get extra brownie points in heaven if you complain enough about being persecuted or something like that.

  18. Canada can have him.

  19. Both those videos are too funny.
    I just launched my news blog. Its not about polygamy or FLDS, but I did post an article on Warren Jeffs and linked back to many of these great source sites.
    So yes, this is pimping my site, in a way, some of you might like this post. http://bsotp.wordpress.com/

  20. Whining has worked for them, so far.

  21. Actually, Uncle Rulon is still being sealed to wives, still having children, and is the one directing who should be kicked out of the FLDS. Check out the new article at: http://flds101.blogspot.com/2010/01/flds-beliefs-101-rulon-jeffs-renewed.html

    ……………………..

    Uncle Rulon is fathering children from the afterlife?!

    Thanks a lot – now I can’t get the lyrics to “Start Me Up” out of my head.

  22. how exactly do you explain to a child that there father died 3 years before they were even born?

  23. I was going to go with a live version from 1981, but decided 25 more years would be appropriate.

  24. They rock.

  25. Hey, I read a lot of blogs on a daily basis and for the most part, people lack substance but, I just wanted to make a quick comment to say GREAT blog!…..I”ll be checking in on a regularly now….Keep up the good work! :)

    I’m Out! :)

  26. so far there are 4 mug shots of warren – all in different colored outfits.

    first is the nevada mug shot where he is wearing a button down white oxford shirt. the nevada highway patrol allowed him to change from his tee shirt into the collared shirt before they took his “portrait”.

    the green and white striped prison shirt seen in the video above is his Utah mug shot when he checked into purgatory jail.

    when he was transferred to utah state prison he wore a solid orange jump suit.

    when he was transferred to mohave county jail in kingman he wore an orange and white striped jump suit.

    when he goes to texas there will be another mug shot.

    and when the feds get him there will still yet another mug shot.

    eventually there will be enough different mug shots to make a really nice collage of warren “touring” various western prisons.

  27. No Disneyland, tanning salons or late night Showtime on this tour.

  28. but, it will be a high security tour

  29. Plural wives, plural prisons. Fitting.

  30. FLDS101’s latest article is an interesting one. It’s really not so surprising that Warren Jeffs has his own particular pathology given how he was raised.

    The problem with Warren is that he inflicts his pathology on everyone else.

  31. The problem is that the group accepts his pathology and interprets it as holiness.

  32. Crazy = holy, hmmmm. Well, I suppose that’s happened a few times before. Did you know many scholars believe Joan de’ Arc had schizophrenia? ;)

  33. The problem is that the group accepts his pathology and interprets it as holiness.

    ………………………………….

    It will be interesting if another male FLDS member steps up and says “Hey, God sent ME a revelation saying Warren’s out and I’m in charge now.”

    Joseph Smith didn’t think it through when he first proclaimed anybody can get revelations straight from God. Who’s to say which revelations are valid and which aren’t? I just finished reading “Under the Banner of Heaven” for the second time, and Dan Lafferty is 100% sure that he is Elijah and will be the one proclaiming Jesus’ Second Coming.

  34. ‘Fruit of the Poisoned Tree’= Fumarse Deficiency.

    Wonder if Cupcake has lost all of her frosting when she says that Kindred Spirits all reject and belittle the Mormon Prophet Joseph Smith. I post here regularly and can only recall a handful of strong statements about him. Now if you want to discuss what really gets the KS focus, she should mention Warren Steed Jeffs and all of his ‘Bad Acts’ that would reflect a truer set of strong comments and forceful opposition. Warrant is beloved by only his flock and never criticized for any of the consequences of his ‘Holy War’, rather amazing and a definite fanatical viewpoints.

  35. Warren is the biggest fruit the FLDS produced. By FAR.

  36. Anyone read the latest in National Geographic?

  37. Yes A-li-n and there is NOTHING about the FLDS in it regardless what fool mudpucky says.

  38. national geographic

  39. doh! delete the last and this one. was doing web search.

  40. I must be honest here, I do reject and belittle Joseph Smith. Of course I also reject and belittle a lot of other power hungry, lustful men who masqueraded as religious leaders too.

  41. Rebeckah: I must be honest here, I do reject and belittle Joseph Smith. Of course I also reject and belittle a lot of other power hungry, lustful men who masqueraded as religious leaders too.

    …………………………….

    You and me both, Rebeckah.

  42. Supposedly the National Geographic article has been pushed back to the February issue.

  43. Seems Stephanie Sinclair is giving some sort of exhibition lecture on February 17, 2010 in Washington DC about polygamy.

  44. “Did you know many scholars believe Joan de’ Arc had schizophrenia?”

    The only reservation that I have about Jean d’Arc is that she had about three minutes alone in a hallway with the Dauphin and in that time convinced him that she was the real thing. The existence of that conversation is well documented, but there were no witnesses to what was actually said. I would love to know what a peasant girl told the prince of France that made him think she was a prophetess.

  45. I think it’s possible to respect people who are currently active in the LDS, and how they live their lives spiritually and at the same time have little respect for the historical Joseph Smith.

  46. Hey! That’s in my territory. Thanks! I’ll look it up.

  47. I think it’s possible to respect people who are currently active in the LDS, and how they live their lives spiritually and at the same time have little respect for the historical Joseph Smith.

    ……………………………………….

    The LDS I know personally are the nicest people in the world. But – I don’t discuss religion with them.

  48. Maybe NatGeo was smarter than Oprah, caught on to the web of lies re how they project themselves. Still, there may be an article, OBJECTIVE, some time in the future.

  49. UNICEF PHOTO OF THE YEAR TAKEN BY STEPHANIE SINCLAIR

    40 YEAR OLD MOHAMMAD WITH HIS 11 YEAR OLD BRIDE

    “Eva Luise Köhler honors Stephanie Sinclair for her picture taken in Afghanistan

    The American photographer Stephanie Sinclair is the winner of the international photo competition “UNICEF Photo of the Year”. Her photo shows a wedding couple in Afghanistan who could not be more opposite. The groom, Mohammed, looks much older than his 40 years. The bride, Ghulam, is still a child; she just turned 11.”

    =====================

    Stephanie evidently has experience with child molesters. What remains to be seen is her portrayel of them. In this case, its shocking and horrific.

    http://scarlettcrusader.wordpress.com/2008/01/01/forced-marriages-sexual-slavery-child-molestation/

  50. Some of the commentary under Stephanies pictures:

    This really makes my blood boil. I’m at a loss for words.

    2scarlett

    ————-

    I cringe down to the core of my being when I think of young girls suffering through such a fate. Pedophilia does not exist in Islam does it? Ha!

    —————–

    I should point out that, although pedophilia can be found in all parts of the globe.
    Parents willingly handing over their children to men who are old enough to be their grandfathers. Or at the very least their fathers. Is WRONG! Making them willing perpetrators to a heinous crime.

    Making it all the more harder to fathom. Or excuse. I am not singling out Muslims. But facts are facts.
    They are just little bitty girls.

  51. Kudos to Stephanie for revealing muslim child brides and polygamy.

    I hope she does as well with this local bunch of UncleTards.

    Great photos. check the guy with a gun, and two wives (one 13).

    What more could a goatherder want in life?

    http://www.nytimes.com/slideshow/2006/07/06/magazine/20060709_BRIDES_SLIDESHOW_1.html

  52. Betty, I understand what you’re saying and I really do try not to be obnoxious. On the other hand, it makes my blood boil when I think of the legacy of misery Joseph Smith and Brigham Young left people who fall for their scheme disguised as divine revelation. (And I actually blame Brigham more than Joseph. Joe started it but Brigham is the one who refined that faith into a torture device aimed particularly at women and children.) Still, respect is something to value. Now if I can just figure out how to disagree respectfully I’ll be golden.

  53. that picture shown of the FLDS in Utah says its a “family”. Which man still in the twin cities is that old and has 5 wives?

  54. Rebeckah, I am totally with you on the boiling blood re the legacy of religious polygyny. Check out this timeline.

    http://www.i4m.com/think/polygamy/polygamy-timeline.htm

    For instance, note that in September of 1842, Smith published a denouncement of polygamy, and in October, he denounced men for coveting other men’s wives. At that time, he already had about 15 secret wives. And during that two month time period, he secretly “married” three women, one who was only 17 and one who was another man’s wife. And his wife Emma was pregnant and near delivery after miscarrying the previous child. Imagine, not only do you share your honey moon with three other women, you share it with the 15 who proceeded. And in the brief two years between that time and his death, he would marry another 15 wives, one as young as 14 and several who were already married to another man, along with other possible sexual liaisons which are less well documented. He only got approval from Emma by threatening her life in public.

    That all ads up to sociopath to me.

  55. I have nothing good to say about the Mormon religion or any of its leaders. Joseph Smith, with the twisted cult he started has done more damage to people’s live and for longer, than everything that happened on 9/11.
    grrrrr…

  56. The Tom Green county jail website shows that Raymond Jessop was released 10 January 2010, this dosen’t mean he’s a free man, but that he’s taking that long ride to Huntsville, TX on that white prison bus. He better like white, as that is what all inmates in Texas prisons wear. He will be singing those Texas prison blues now!

    Don’t know if this link will work: http://justice.co.tom-green.tx.us/Scripts/UVlink.isa/tgcrisc/WEBSERV/JailSearch?action%253Dview%26track%253D345493

    Schleicher County SO
    Confined 11/20/2009 05:09pm
    Released 01/10/2010 05:51pm

    Defendant
    Jessop, Raymond Merril
    2420 Cr 300
    Eldorado, Tx 76936
    White Male 5′ 8″ 160 09/01/1971
    Hair Brown
    Eyes Blue
    SO# 82340

    Cause Charge Disposition Bond
    COMM*991 SEXUAL ASSAULT CHILD 11/20/2009 – Held NOBOND

  57. they said he would be moved right after the new trial hearing and they were right. hearing on friday, chain gang on sunday.

  58. A Texan

    Thanks for the find! Pretty cryptic, whaddya think the “Held NOBOND” means?

    COMM*991 SEXUAL ASSAULT CHILD 11/20/2009 – Held NOBOND

  59. Pretty cryptic, whaddya think the “Held NOBOND” means?

    The County system has to deal with folks at all stages in the criminal process. They’ve got the newly arrested and awaiting charges as well as the convicted. NOBOND means the guy can’t get out by posting a bond. For Jessop that’s a given since he’s been sentenced and is being transferred to TDC. However, for another person it could mean they were denied bail while awaiting trial.

  60. No release upon posting an appeal bond.

  61. I usually don’t post on Blogs but ya forced me to, great info.. excellent! … I’ll add a backlink and bookmark your site.

  62. So I guess that means he’ll be cruising around the 8×10 CelloSteel Kingdom.

    Wonder if Nat Geo is gonna include mugshots in their report? I’ve seen a lot of them.

    And that pic of the muslim child molester that won stefanie sinclair the Unicef photo of the year award – we’ve got some pics quite similar starring yours truly Warren Jeffs.

    Only instead of the age difference 40-11 its more like 50-12.

    Even worse!

  63. Too bad she couldn’t have been the one to take the infamous pics of Warren kissing (while holding) his very young brides.

  64. For instance, note that in September of 1842, Smith published a denouncement of polygamy, and in October, he denounced men for coveting other men’s wives. At that time, he already had about 15 secret wives

    …………………….

    See, this is what I don’t get. This is a man who was supposed to be holy, but he was a liar and a hypocrite, not to mention horny as a goat. How do you base an entire religion on a foundation of sand? Plus not one bit of archeological evidence for the vast civilizations he claimed inhabited North America. No wonder Mormon leaders condemn just about every history written about them.

  65. For instance, note that in September of 1842, Smith published a denouncement of polygamy, and in October, he denounced men for coveting other men’s wives. At that time, he already had about 15 secret wives
    =======================================================
    I guess after having 15 different wives he didn’t want any other man to suffer his misery.

  66. Anon E Mouse,

    I feel sort of the same way about the multiple Pope situation, the Pope who was a grandson of a Pope, the Immaculate Conception being announced 1800 years after Mary’s life and in opposition to a few passages in the New Testament, the Council of Nicea involving huge amounts of real life politics and a probable assassination plot or people who are more likely to quote Paul than Jesus. I don’t understand Calvin’s hateful view of God as a being who knowingly created most souls to be tormented in hell forever. I don’t understand eating kosher in a world with refrigeration. I never understood salvation through faith alone, as it removes any reason to live well and thus any reason to live on this planet with free will, since we could chose God or not in the spiritual plane (and PLEASE don’t try to explain it to me again!).

    And then there’s Scientology…..

    Really, Utah does not have a corner on the crazy market. It’s just a particular brand of crazy. IMHO.

  67. Funny, Alin. But improbable. Also, he married another 15 plus in the next two years, so I don’t think HE was the one who was miserable.

  68. Al

    HA HA HA

    Oh yeah, and those 15 pesky sets of in-laws. Rrrruuufff

    Well, Joe was maleable like Gold, he could shape-shift into anything he wanted on any given day.

    Kinda like Warren – such a good student.

  69. Betty

    “Funny, Alin. But improbable. Also, he married another 15 plus in the next two years, so I don’t think HE was the one who was miserable.”

    ———————

    And there is only one reason why he stopped when he did.

  70. Raymond is now in the custody of the Texas prison system, see here

  71. How do you base an entire religion on a foundation of sand? – Anon E Mouse

    And then there’s Scientology….. – Betty

    Hmmm, was it PT Barnum that said there’s a sucker born every minute?

  72. Neutered Pharisee is proof.

  73. Does anyone have the update on current ‘Child Brides’ still left to be indicted by the San Angelo Grand Jury? I trust by now that Teresa Jo Steed is on the list along with all the other sexually abused minor mothers still awaiting perpetrators indictments. Can somebody, please, post the list of sexual assault Priesthood rape perpetrators still not indicted by the San Angelo Grand Jury.

  74. Congratulations, FldsTexas for 250,000+ readers/posters count total of better informed facts and evidence based upon filed documents and Court room rulings. Best place to eyewitness the Truth.

  75. FOOD FOR THOUGHT

    IRT Brookes thread.

    Religious Socialism? If you study Brighams plans you will see the bulk of it ended in failure, at least the socialist /polygamist /financial /language efforts.

    While every city in Utah was founded by polygamists, that “principle” is no longer legal.

    99.99999% of lands in Utah are public or private, with only a tiny bit still held in a communistic fashion.

    And now that tiny bit has failed too. In one fell swoop, Warren has destructed both many families, children, and this program that Utah let float for too long.

    The “State of Deseret” failed to prosper. Oh, except perhaps Las Vegas, that town was indeed inside the boundaries of Deseret.

    However the land was owned by Mexico and it was ceded to the United States by treaty.

    See the map and story of Brighams Deseret ambitions here:

    http://www.lightplanet.com/mormons/daily/history/1844_1877/deseret_state_eom.htm

  76. Yeah, I saw that, especially noting Riki’s comment that it was the longest running religious socialistic group and the only one still in practice. Right. In a typical combination of ignorance and arrogance, she ignores the Shakers, who started in the late 1700’s, became socialist in the 1830’s and still have one existing community with a handful (literally) of members.

    Would you consider religious orders, like Catholic nuns, Buddhist priests and ashrams to be communistic? If so, I’m guessing that the oldest continual community of that sort is probably in the Far East, in India or China or somewhere in between those countries. But there are buildings in Europe that have held religious orders since the 12th century, so I’m thinking they have the FLDS UEP beat on that one.

    The ashram near me has a few monks (less than 20), a dormitory full of single teachers who are permanent residents, and many families who live on the ashram property. They use a system of combined private and communal ownership, with a work exchange program. Their greatest problem is health care. Well, that and deer eating their gardens. LOL.

    One of my aunts on my father’s side was in a Catholic Worker’s movement commune back in the 30-40’s. They still exist, although my aunt was only there a few years. They were persecuted quite strongly during the McCarthy era since they were promoting a distribution of wealth worldwide and were anti war. My uncle, her husband, was a conscientious objector and spent most of WWII in jail. I come by it honestly.

    There are some fairly long lasting non-religious communes in the US, one of the oldest is near me in Virginia, Twin Oaks, dating back to the 70’s and originally based on the book Walden Two.

  77. The ashram near me has a few monks (less than 20), a dormitory full of single teachers who are permanent residents, and many families who live on the ashram property. They use a system of combined private and communal ownership, with a work exchange program. Their greatest problem is health care. Well, that and deer eating their gardens. LOL.

    …………………………..

    Hey Betty, that’s not the one across the James River from Wingina, VA is it? I have family in that area.

  78. Yes, in fact it is. Integral Yoga’s Lotus Temple in Buckingham county. Founded by Swami Satchedananda, now deceased.

    I’ve been there several times for retreats and such. It’s beautiful country, about 50 miles from me. I’ve also met the woman, now in her thirties, who was part of a scandal there a few years back when her family tried to sue the ashram organization because she left school and married an older man. However, she was 22 when she did that and neither one of them were married to anyone else, so the only reason I can see that it was a scandal was that her family was old school Chinese. She’s still happily married to that man and a teacher; they spend a lot of their time traveling to various schools all over the US and the world, giving conferences and teacher trainings.

  79. What a small world, Betty! I visited that temple with a cousin, now deceased, who lived on the other side of the river. You could see it from her house, she called it, (with all due respect, she liked the folks there) “the pink titty.” It is a beautiful temple, in a beautiful location. I actually have LOTS of relatives in that part of Virginia, although I’ve never lived there, it still feels like “home.”

  80. I believe the Coptic Christian Church in Egypt has the longest existing monastic communal community that dates back the the first Century AD, for all Christian churches, Mormonism formed in the first half of the 19th Century rather recent.

  81. The core group that started what is today the Amana Colonies started in 1714. Last I heard, they’re still at it.

    It being living communally, making appliances and awesome wine. (If you like the sweet fruity stuff. And I do.)

    Their shops are in their basements, and they invite you in to try their wine and cheese. Nice people.

    No watchtowers, barbed wire or hiding the kiddies.

    Of course to find them, you have to leave Utard and go out and see the real USA.

  82. That 40andwhatever poster on the Trib boards is claiming the YFZ raid was a Texas Ranger conspiracy to murder the FLDS “elite” and/or (take your pick) murder the children.

    Cue Twilight Zone theme song . . .

    Proof being, among other things, LE were wearing bullet-proof vests so that must mean they were expecting violence. Ignorance knows no bounds – the vests are part of a police officer’s uniform, they all wear them, all the time.

    Other proof: “many” articles were written (no links to even one) explaing that because of what happened at Waco, “everybody knew” a raid on YFZ would result in a similar outcome. Therefore, Rozita the Hoaxer’s phone calls were attempted murder since she knew what would happen. The obvious blooper in this scenario: if “everybody” knew there was going to be an explosive Waco-like raid on YFZ, why didn’t the FLDS simply send the children elsewhere? They seemed to have been caught by surprise.

    Further proof: (this is the funnietst one of all) Rozita was getting “inside” information. Hello! So the allegations WERE true after all.

  83. Anon E Mouse, for whatever it is worth the YFZ Ranch removal would be planned based upon the ‘worst case scenario’. immediately, following the raid Sheriff Doran was apologizing for the lack of force and not the excessive use thereof. If you recall the original means of transport was vans and it later required buses. The planners had no idea that 550+ adults and children were in residence and the planning likely didn’t exceed force enough for 150+ residents. Ambulances were woefully short as standby contingency and the planners were worried about claims of a shortfall plan.

    Repeating the uniformed lies has been ongoing every month for a year now, nothing new in proclaiming their fantasy take on the events.

  84. cajIM: Repeating the uniformed lies has been ongoing every month for a year now, nothing new in proclaiming their fantasy take on the events.

    ……………………..

    These conspiracy theories are bizarre and full of hate. But then again, these are people who are attempting to justify child molestation, so I suppose I shouldn’t be so shocked.

  85. Cause # 991 & Raymond Merril Jessop, Oct. 26, sexual abuse of a child. (Cause 999) bigamy charge.

    Cause #992 Allan Eugene Keate, Dec. 7, sexual abuse of a child.

    Cause # 993 Michael Emack, Jan. 25, 2010, sexual abuse of a child and (Cause 998) bigamy.

    Cause # 995 Merrill Leroy Jessop, March 8, 2010, sexual abuse of a child and (Cause 994) bigamy.

    Cause #1000 Lehi Barlow Jeffs, April 26, 2010, sexual abuse of a child and (Cause 1001 is bigamy)

    Cause # 1002 Abram Harker Jeffs, June 7, 2010, sexual abuse of a child and (Cause 1003) bigamy.

    Cause # 1004 Keith William Dutson Jr., July 26, 2010, sexual abuse of a child.

    Cause #1013, 1014, 1015 * Wendell Loy Nielson, Sept. 7, 2010, three counts of bigamy.

    Cause #1016 Frederick Merril Jessop, Oct. 11, 2010, conducting an unlawful marriage ceremony involving a minor.

    Cause # 1019 Leroy Johnson Steed, Dec. 6, 2010, first-degree felony sexual assault of a child,

    1018 second-degree felony bigamy, third-degree felony bigamy

    1020 third-degree felony tampering with physical evidence.

  86. The more I read and research…the more disgustingly fascinated I become. It’s like a new train wreck, every day. You just CAN’T look away…ya might miss the next train wreck!

  87. Are there ANY investigative journalists working on this? Or have they all been suckered like Oprah.

  88. Mike Watkiss in Phoenix, KTVK-Channel 3 is an award winning reporter whom has been covering the FLDS Church for well over the past ten years, see AZfamily.com to know more. Several major newsprint journalists track the FLDS Church saga and I suspect that Warren Jeffs trial(s) is when they refocus events to update this story.

    Portraying the CPS Removal in the most exaggerated and onerous terms, ignores the causes that motivated the action in the first place and an attempt to place the ‘EVIL’ Gentile blame outside of the YFZ Ranch compound. Wanting to discuss the removal is an attempt to change the subject off of the indictments that are bearing the ‘fruit from the poisoned tree’.

  89. Wanting to discuss the removal is an attempt to change the subject off of the indictments that are bearing the ‘fruit from the poisoned tree’.
    ===========================================================
    Aye. Hence why I tend to focus my attention on the legality of the search warrant. Any other argument is superfluous.

  90. caljim, good call on the Coptics as oldest Christian communities. Good call. Also, the Irish had christian communities in which the priests married and had families. These lasted for hundreds of years until the church of rome finally got together the influence to squash that and bring them in line with the rest of the priesthood.

  91. “Any other argument is superfluous.”

    Which explains the education debates.

  92. I agree, it DOES look like a pink tittie. From what I heard, the swami liked titties, but I never met him. I think it looks somewhat absurd plunked down in a Virginina forest, but from the inside it is quite beautiful and an excellent place for meditation and chanting because of how it handles sound and air movement.

  93. Alin, how about the argument that those people are actually performing evil and should be stopped? Hmmmmmmm? You are remarkably silent on that? Do you think the evidence is false, including baby DNA?

    And then, there’s the argument that the warrants were and are all actually legal, which is what I believe.

  94. Texastwist….and the constant assertions that the young women make choices AND are old enough to do so…..and that suggestion that the young woman wanted to go through three days of labor without any medical assistance….etc, etc, etc.

  95. Jim

    Yes, when the big kahuna Warren Jeffs comes up for trial, the media will show up in droves. The folks being tried now are just too insignificant for the large media to give a lot of coverage.

  96. Betty

    I firmly believe that Al-in is FLDS. With the evidence already out there, you’d need to be way, way out on the fringe to support this group.

    The non-FLDS seem to have boiled down to the weird (mainly males) who don’t see anything wrong with 14 year old brides for 50 year old men and a few ultra anti-government folks.

  97. Here is an interesting question :
    Given that many of these older men with child brides may suffer from sexual dysfunction, what percentage of these men do you think have been taking viagra and related drugs, and what percentage obtained it at government (Medicaid) expense?

  98. Cat

    I think most of whatever welfare fraud is done by the women posing as “single” mothers. Most of the men have jobs that would exclude them from Medicaid. If they’re old enough they could be on Medicare, but last time I checked it didn’t cover Viagra and related ED drugs.

  99. Ron,
    Medicare does cover viagra, as does Medicaid and the VA.

  100. Medicaid gives out viagra?!? Dang.

    I am over 55, most of my friends are between 45 and 60, and I talk rather frankly with most of my girl friends. The only one in that age group I know of who has erectile problems is very, very fat and has circulation problems and COPD. All the other men function just fine at lest a few times a week. From the reports of my mother’s side of the family, men in their 70’s who are fit and active also function just fine, although that may be statistically improbable. I know that the adds on TV show healthy, trim men in their 50’s talking about ED, but I think that is a fantasy. Men with ED are either a lot older than 50 or they are very unhealthy.

    Now the FEAR of ED and the fact that their libidos begin to decline around 50 from wanting it every 15 minutes to wanting it only every other day may make them take viagra. But that’s more of a psychological problem and a result of biting off more than they can chew by taking on three 16 year olds. I don’t think that’s technically ED.

    From what I understand about male fertility, though, the problem is not the delivery system at that age but the quality and quantity of the swimmers. I would think you would get more miscarriages, more birth defects and a lower ratio of pregnancies vs attempts as the man goes from 50 -70. Over 70, all bets are off.

  101. Catwhisperer,

    Isn’t that kind of coverage a state by state thing?

  102. I’ve been reading about sociopaths, and now I see them everywhere, Ron. And I care less and less what philosophy they use to justify their total lack of empathy and conscience.

  103. Alinusara the original search warrant is questionable but the hearing proved that the LE had acted in good faith and proper conduct. The opposition had every chance to present evidence or challenge the facts presented. I believe Judge Conn in Arizona will ultimately rule that Texas evidence will be admissible for lack of any proof otherwise. The second search warrant was granted based upon eye-witness observations made by law enforcement and CPS representatives at the YFZ Ranch, no challenge was ever proffered that any of those eye-witness accounts were tainted in any way and many lead to the San Angelo Grand Jury indictments. Even a successful challenge to the first search warrant would not overturn the second search warrant which brings up the topic of any superfluous arguments. Notice the third search warrant issued to the FBI has never even been formally challenged and may well lead to RICO/Mann Act(s) charges.

    Stay focused on the legality of the search warrants as the parade of indictments come back with positive convictions. The RICO Act is triggered after a series of felony convictions proves there is a organized crime syndicate that exists and is guilty of serial felonies and misdemeanors. You understand that the Mann Act, if invoked, would be for violation of this federal statute and not Texas criminal laws.

    Hoping for exoneration at this point is narrowing down to a near zero scenario. Can you recall any likesame circumstances of an organization so mired in legal proceedings and convictions that was ruled to be released and overturned all of these convictions?

  104. Here are some statistics regarding erectile dysfunction. It is more common than you might think.
    Men and their partners frequently under – report it according to the literature.
    From the The Journal of Urology, Volume 163, Issue 2, Pages 460-463

    The crude incidence rate for erectile dysfunction was 25.9 cases per 1,000 men (95% confidence interval [CI] 22.5 to 29.9). The annual incidence rate increased with each decade of age and was 12.4 cases per 1,000 men (95% CI 9.0 to 16.9), 29.8 (24.0 to 37.0) and 46.4 (36.9 to 58.4) for men 40 to 49, 50 to 59 and 60 to 69 years old, respectively. The age adjusted risk of erectile dysfunction was higher for men with lower education, diabetes, heart disease and hypertension. Population projections for men 40 to 69 years old suggest that 17,781 new cases of erectile dysfunction in Massachusetts and 617,715 in the United States are expected annually.

  105. Betty,
    Medicaid coverage for viagra, in terms of numbers of pills dispensed per month, may vary from state to state, but on average, 7 tabs per month are dispensed, because studies show that is the average frequency of intercourse for most males.

    Medicare covers 7 tabs per month, consistent with the literature.

    I am wondering if any of the men incarcerated as sex offenders in these trials might be requesting viagra when they are released, and if they will receive their prescriptions.

    I can’t believe that it is easy for a 50 yr old man to keep up with several teenagers….

  106. Yes, when the big kahuna Warren Jeffs comes up for trial, the media will show up in droves. The folks being tried now are just too insignificant for the large media to give a lot of coverage
    ——–
    Yes and there will probably also be more media coverage for Merril Jessop’s trial, due in part (I imagine), to the publicity from Carolyn’s book.

  107. Actually, speaking of Carolyn’s book, does anyone know if it is still being made into a movie with Katherine Heigl? I keep expecting to see early photos of Heigl in FLDS garb & hair-poof.

  108. Betty,
    Medicaid coverage for ED drugs may vary from state to state, in terms of the number of tablets dispensed.
    Medicare permits 7 tablets per month to be dispensed, consistent with statistics which reveal that the average man has intercourse 7 times per month.
    It can’t be easy for many of these 50 year old men to keep up with several teenagers at once….

  109. Betty: I agree, it DOES look like a pink tittie. From what I heard, the swami liked titties, but I never met him. I think it looks somewhat absurd plunked down in a Virginina forest, but from the inside it is quite beautiful and an excellent place for meditation and chanting because of how it handles sound and air movement.

    ………………..

    We went there because my cousin said they had a nice little vegetarian restaurant, but unfortunately it was closed. I don’t think we saw any people at all. That is a beautiful, unspoiled part of Virginia, I have letters from family members written in the early 1900’s describing the rural lifestyle. When city folk came to visit, they stayed for months!

  110. Wanting to discuss the removal is an attempt to change the subject off of the indictments that are bearing the ‘fruit from the poisoned tree’.
    ===========================================================
    Aye. Hence why I tend to focus my attention on the legality of the search warrant. Any other argument is superfluous.

    ………………

    Yes Alin, we know you believe that the FLDS men have a right to have sex with underage girls. But they don’t, and your attempts to justify it have been feeble at best.

    The FLDS slogan: If it bleeds, it breeds

  111. Anon E, that’s really gross and utterly accurate.

  112. 40’s new nic at the trib is Malicia, it just fits, like cupcake did.

  113. Catwhisperer, I’d have to ask what the definition of ED is? Is it “just as attracted to 14 year olds as I ever was” or “needs a boost now and then” or “Deadwood is not just a town in Arizona”?

    But this line sort of agrees with my totally non scientific observations: “The age adjusted risk of erectile dysfunction was higher for men with lower education, diabetes, heart disease and hypertension. “

  114. Anon E Mouse,

    There is no restaurant that I know of, but the cafeteria is alive and well. The community is a lot smaller than it was when the swami was alive, but I don’t think it’s in any danger of shutting down at this point. In fact, I just got a catalog from them for this year’s events and they have a full calendar of activities.

  115. I can’t take credit for “if it bleeds, it breeds,” I think I read it in the Trib forums.

    I know I can be crude, but I feel there has to be a reminder that these men, getting their cues from Joseph Smith and Brigham Young, are out to get their dicks into as many vaginas as possible.

    Gotta hand it to Joseph, linking access to Heaven directly to quantity of earthly poonanny, what a stroke of genius (pun intended).

    I wrote that as an antidote to those photos of homes empty of men but full of pastel prairie dresses, making the girls and women look pure and chaste as if they were all living in a nunnery and the children were found under cabbage leaves out in the garden.

  116. It simply boggles my mind that the apologists still want to go back to the warrant. The FLDS spend probably millions of dollars on attorneys and investigators. Walther gave them a lengthy hearing to bring out whatever evidence they had.

    What did they produce? Nothing of consequence. All they did was the “woulda, shoulda, coulda” dance that produced no hard evidence of any sort of any malfeasance or even gross negligence.

    What’s actually sort of annoying is that it apparently took a hoax phone call to FINALLY get LE to get a warrant. Why there wasn’t some investigation prior to that call rather boggles my mind.

    The FLDS got all the protection the law allows. They simply got caught with their pants (literally) down.

  117. What was Alamo’s quote “menstruation is consent”? Something like that. Prosecutors love mouthy perps.

  118. Are you claiming Anon E Mouse that one of the ‘Hallmark Moments’ of Warrenite propaganda is to stage still photos that reflect an idealized image but don’t actually reflect the harsh realities. I’m shocked, shocked I tell you! Still photos answer no tough reporters questions nor answer any Press conference inquiries, either. ‘National Geographic’ is full of static dispalys of moments in time but answer no lies and can misrepresent the truth. The trials speak volumes on the propaganda campaign under the guise of,”Answer Them Nothing” they proffer no defense because they would be subject to cross examination, file no counter suits because discovery would pierce their veil of lies and have resorted to cloister themselves onto gulags in a passive resistance to avoid further exposure and public witnessing to their criminal lifestyles.

    We’re supposed to be fooled by this charade, hardly.

  119. Ron, you know Merrill kept up a lie to the county sheriff that there were only 100 or so total folks on that breeding ranch. They had no idea babies were popping, that girls were being brought in for their criminal breeding program not just from USA but Canada and maybe Mexico for all anyone knows.

    Mmm yeah for their whines about warrants and whatnot they need to put up or shut up as it’s said.

  120. Speaking of Carolyn and Merril Jessop, does anyone know if he ever paid the child support he agreed to? If he hasn’t, are they going back to court to release the evidence that his agreement pulled off the block? I, for one, would LOVE to know just what it was that had Merril and the penishood of the FLDS running scared. Please, Carolyn, if you’re reading this, would you consider assuaging my sordid curiosity?

  121. Also, Anon E Mouse the FLDS Church called a witness Doctor William J. Walsh during the CPS Removal hearing back in 2008 and he was asked to answer when specifically the FLDS Church considered a young girl eligible to be married, point blank the good physician stated,”Age of physical development”. He had been the attending doctor for multiple FLDS Church birthings and had no doubts that a females first menstruation constituted eligibility for matrimonial wedlock. That testimony was vehemently denied and the doctors lack of currency was sited as a dated and uninformed opinion. Today, the words of Doc Walsh are proven to have been entirely factual and correct as to specific time frame of referencing the age of bridal eligibility, even though he was their called witness and giving a sworn testimony.

  122. Rebeckah, to the best of my knowledge, Merril Jessop has NOT complied with the court’s child support order.

  123. Thanks, Rattle. Why am I not surprised? Is anyone else shocked that the leader of this fine group of religious wingnuts LIED to the court about taking responsibility for the children he abandoned as soon as a court awarded custody of them to their mother? (That is, if the reports of non-payment are true. I’ll be surprised to find they aren’t true, though. How often do men agree to pay child support in court and fail to follow through. Doesn’t Texas arrest child support shirkers?)

  124. It simply boggles my mind that the apologists still want to go back to the warrant.
    ………………………….

    That’s all they’ve got. It was attempted murder, dontcha know – they’ve got proof.

  125. It was a ‘Fishing Expedition’ made up of unfounded accusations that underage girls were being married illegally and denied informed consent by witholding sex education and knowledge of the laws. Completely outrageous and without a single witness because you can’t believe any apostates, can’t prove the honeymoon took place on the YFZ Raunch and DNA is Gentile proof used to fool the devil himself and you can’t put ‘Child Brides’ on the witness stand or they’ll lose their parental rights. Just ask the kids, just ask the prophet or just ask any of the selected ‘Templebuilders’, they’ll perjure themselves for us.

  126. “Doesn’t Texas arrest child support shirkers?”

    Texas does. But it tends to do it rather slowly, I’m afraid.

  127. Thanks, Rattle. Why am I not surprised? Is anyone else shocked that the leader of this fine group of religious wingnuts LIED to the court about taking responsibility for the children he abandoned as soon as a court awarded custody of them to their mother? (That is, if the reports of non-payment are true. I’ll be surprised to find they aren’t true, though. How often do men agree to pay child support in court and fail to follow through. Doesn’t Texas arrest child support shirkers?)

    ……………………

    If he’s NOT paying, he must be scrambling to hide his assets – I wonder how much he had stashed under Barbara’s name?

    Banks don’t comply with “answer them nothing” when they get served with warrants for account records.

  128. i think he might find the inside of a jail cell sooner rather than later if he continues on his path of non-payment.

  129. Oh, yeah….Bishop F. Merril Jessop is going to the Big House alright. We just don’t know for how long a stay is all.

  130. well his stay for contempt of court can be until he pays up and then a set time afterwards, but until he pays up, he’ll be in continual contempt.

  131. Well, the ‘Answer Them Nothing’ strategy in Holy War is designed to extract the win to their side, don’t be thinking Bishop Merril can or will pay if Warrant says ,”NO”. This is Democracy versus Theocracy and was spawn in Utah and exported to Texas. It has to be combated step by step, measure by measure until it is finished and Law & Order prevails.

  132. I would think garnishing income would come before putting the dead beat parent in jail.

  133. Well, Bishop F. Merril Jessop at his aged condition was supposed to have his Social Security check attached and all of his other income I am sure is in cash based upon Raymond’s known payment history of using check cashing facilities.

  134. Not too long ago, I saw part of an interview with Carolyn Jessop in which she stated that Merrill’s social security wss being sent directly to her to cover child support obligations.

  135. That was supposed to have happened. But it’s Merrill …

  136. Does anyone know how the FLDS assigned marriage system works as related to attractive females. Such as, does Warren and his most loyal men end up with especially attractive girls? And how does that factor play out with others. Are less attractive, or overweight, girls assigned the same as the cute ones?
    Or are these relationsips truely considered a spirtual union and physical attractiveness not considered.

  137. JonDana, hey

    …this is a really tacky thing of me to say, but, I’ll own it…

    ….it doesn’t matter how off-handedly pretty any of the FLDS girls turn out to be. The men are such DNA-losers that without this sexual Ponzi scheme they’d be hard pressed to get a $10 hooker to …um well…yeah. So sure, the pretty girls go to the highest bidder, fer sure. That’s P.I.M.P. Economics.

  138. PIMP economics

    LMAO

    Sad but true!

  139. “Doesn’t Texas arrest child support shirkers?”

    Heck yeah they do. Child support folks often more time for not paying child support than for most misdemeanors including DWI.

    Putting them in jail is somewhat of a last resort although aggrieved spouse will sometimes try to use it as a first response.

    Like most things it goes in cycles. When I was first in practice rarely did someone go to jail. 10 years ago they were sticking them in the county jail at the drop of a hat. Now (well at least in some courts) there is a little more balance.

  140. Not too long ago, I saw part of an interview with Carolyn Jessop in which she stated that Merrill’s social security wss being sent directly to her to cover child support obligations.

    They can garnish old age benefits for child support. However garnishment is limited to 50%. Merrill also could have redirected his social security to Carolyn to try to fulfill his obligations.

    Given that its from that evil nasty gentile government it’s not surprising that he may have done a full redirect.

  141. http://texasflds.wordpress.com/2009/09/29/jessop-child-support-case-the-bigger-picture/

    http://texasflds.wordpress.com/2009/08/29/jessop-v-jessop/

    Those 2 previous threads cover the nuts and bolts of the child support case that was heard in texas.

  142. Read the latest post here on ‘FLDS Suspected Underage Mothers With Children’. Inaugural display list of what Warrant Jeffs preaching translates to in ruined lives of American youths. Don’t be propaganized by print, blog nor video interviews designed to avert the focus and shroud the truth. ‘Victimless’ crimes don’t foster pregnancy(s) to the future generation of innocent children. This form of sexual assault should have an enhancement above 1st Degree Felony as premeditated, heinous act and rationalized as a celestial commandment.

    RICO/Mann Acts are becoming overdue and Federal Government action is prerequisite to redressing this organized underworld crime wave.

  143. cajiM: I totally agree with an enhancement.

  144. Thanks JonDana wait until you read my draft of a ‘Spay and Neuter’ Bill, not.

  145. Spay and Neuter bill? Does it include men who take underage girls as wifes?

  146. Yes and mothers that witness at their celestial grip, as well.

  147. Have we run across direct responses yet to the last 2 articles?

  148. Another fun article to boggle your mind. I’ve disected Warren’s 10 phone calls, his jailhouse confessions, and unraveled what he was saying and all the instructions he gave. These two days were probably the most truthful days of his life. See: http://flds101.blogspot.com/2009/05/flds-history-101-two-days-of-truth.html

  149. FLDS101: Thanks you’re awesome.

  150. “Those who are persons of faith can easily conclude that Warren is taking his instruction from a dark source, not from the Lord.”

    ..and I would be one of those persons. The dark source is from within Warren’s mind. Even a psychotherapist would have a challenge untwisting Warren. Would be like trying to unraveling a rubberband ball.

  151. dark source, not from the Lord

    Dark. Light. Who knows? Supposedly it’s the same God who says “murder every man, woman, and child of the Amelkites” and then says “love your neighbor as yourself.”

    We create our God. Just like we create our id, ego and superego.

  152. “…Just like we create our id, ego and superego….”
    Ron,
    In psychiatry, it is not believed that an individual creates their own superego. The superego represents the internalized ideals of society. Nor can it truly be said that an individual creates their id, as the id represents unconscious primitive drives which are believed to be present at birth. Ego development, however, is something that an individual, their parents, mentors,teachers, religious leaders, and society in general, all have a hand in shaping.

  153. “….Just like we create our id, ego and superego….”

    Have you heard of Penfield’s experiments in the 1950’s? Eric Berne unraveled some of it, and came up with transactional analysis.

    It seems a lot of what’s on the ‘Parent’ tapes are what a child hears. Here’s a fun experiment. Pick something your family does, and you have no idea why. Then start asking questions until you find out the answer. Parent tapes of that sort are handed down generation to generation unedited.

    That’s one reason why I admired Judge Walther so much. She had the wisdom to know that even very young children were being influenced by the situation on the ranch, and imprinted, if you will, for the rest of their lives.

  154. http://blogs.sltrib.com/slcrawler/index.php?p=9186&more=1&c=1&tb=1&pb=1

  155. Miele said : “That’s one reason why I admired Judge Walther so much. She had the wisdom to know that even very young children were being influenced by the situation on the ranch, and imprinted, if you will, for the rest of their lives.”

    Absolutely Miele.
    I am deeply troubled that any group of people could have their “superegos” formed in a society run by people like Warren Jeffs et al. The government has been much too slow to intervene.

  156. I sure hope that the individual has the ability to consciously reprogram the superego, or there is no hope for any of us to rise out of the misfortune of a bad choice of parents. Not saying that it would be easy, but how else would you describe what people do in the years after they leave this or any other cult?

  157. I would have to check the literature on that.
    I would think that the superego could be reprogrammed, as it represents the internalized ideals of the society in which you live, or the “conscience”

  158. we create our id, ego and superego

    I suppose I probably should have said our sense of self.

    very young children were being influenced by the situation on the ranch, and imprinted, if you will, for the rest of their lives

    The idea of “imprinting” goes to the whole nature vs. nurture discussion.

    I was having a discussion about dogs with another attorney the other day. We both adopted dogs from shelters that had supposedly been abused. She was saying how how happy go lucky hers was. I was telling her how neurotic mine was. (Yes, I have an anal retentive puppy!)

    Anyway, the discussion turned to how abuse affects individuals differently. Is that because of their biological constitution or because of environment? I think both have a place, but I tend to lean more toward nature.

  159. Check out that fake, phony fraud “Megan” over at Megan’s Polyblog.
    She has been exposed by her readership as a fraud – apparently she has posted the fetal ultrasound of another mother, claiming that it is her child.

  160. Here is the link :

    http://megans-polyblog.blogspot.com/2010/01/20-questions.html#comments

  161. Well the NatGeo article is now online, just read it, it is not the “glowing” report that bile mudpucky and company are hoping for, but it could be a lot stronger:

    http://ngm.nationalgeographic.com/2010/02/polygamists/anderson-text

    Here is a link to Stephanie Sinclair’s photo’s

    http://ngm.nationalgeographic.com/2010/02/polygamists/sinclair-photography

  162. Yikes! Did a public outing of Megan’s bogus ultrasounds end her career as a plyg-poseur? I went to her blog and it appears to have gone “poof” like something disappearing from a bad magician’s hat.

    I guess “Megan” can go back to whatever he was doing before he got that bright idea…

  163. Keeping Sweet it looks like Megan’s blog has now been taken down. When you try to go to it now (2:30 est) you get this message:

    “The blog you were looking for was not found.”

  164. LOL, great minds thing GFNY

  165. Someone had the foresight to capture a screen image of Meg’s bogus ultrasound post:

    And here’s a screen image of the blog she lifted it from:

    Whoever caught this, bravo!

  166. Whoever captured those screenshots has my admiration; that was wonderful sleuthing.

  167. Hey all, it would be a bit much to go into TA here, but yes the tapes in the Parent are unedited. Parent/Adult/Child in TA roughly translate to SuperE/Ego/Id.

    Betty, the reason a person can survive after a abusive situation is that the adult is able to edit. The adult acting much like a computer. The tapes are still there, but the adult can learn they aren’t valid. Although it is not easy.

    I’ll give you an example. I have a Parent tape that says NEVER put anything on a bed. It’s illogical, but it is there non the less. After asking my mother, who had the same tape why we NEVER put anything on the bed, she didn’t know. Finally my grandmother answered that her mother, back in the 1890’s had a neighbor who’s kids had lice. Feather beds were almost irreplaceable, so she told her kids NEVER put anything on the bed. Three generations, tapes unedited.

    My adult knows it’s not valid. I even know where the tape is coming from, and how silly it is. Still, my husband loves to jerk my chain by putting a towel or something on the bed every once in a while to see how long I can stand it. (Usually not long.)

    Now change that to ALWAYS submit to the profit. NEVER disobey your priesthood holder. Then imagine how difficult it really is for the people who have left this cult.

    Ron, Flora and Carolyn have very distinctly different ways of coping. Presumably they have similar tapes. (If either of you are reading this, I want you to know that I think you’re both terrific and I know how hard it is. Come and put a towel on my bed.) They are individuals. How the Adult does the editing and how much it lets the Not-OK Child run loose is highly individual.

    A good example of an OK-child running loose is our very own Stamp. All our OK Childs have great fun going along, laughing and giggling with each HOOT. Great fun! But if you did it in a Courtroom, well – I don’t know what would happen. Attorney’s tend to have strong Adult editors.

    Bless you for adopting a shelter pup. I had a dog that was OCD, too. She came hardwired from the factory that way. I think the same is true for people. Some nature, some nurture.

  168. Miele

    Thank you – I think?

    Yeah, OK, I had too much fun with the Duck song. And others.

    But this thing makes me laugh one minute and angry the next.

    And of course all the sadness that exudes from their situation.

    I’m dissappointed this kind of crap has been allowed to fester so damn long!

    And I am VERY Thankful for TEXAS!

  169. Good info, Miele, I’m glad you took my question seriously. Thanks.

  170. Boy, validation that Megan is a fraud really made my day. Thanks for that!

  171. Yes, “Megan,” the phony “Christian” polygamist’s blog has disappeared.
    She could not keep her story straight.
    First it was the pictures of the whirlpool bath that “Steve” built her… which was cut and pasted from an architectural site on the internet.
    Then the report that women could only visit for 2 weeks without marrying a member of the cult… but Macy stayed over a month without getting married.
    Then the statement that no one in her sect could go on a honeymoon – then her husband’s daughter went on a honeymoon.
    Then the confusion about the approximate dates for her fetus (8 weeks, 10 weeks, 12 weeks, 14 weeks…) and her report that her doctor apparently is able to tell the gender of twins on ultrasound before 20 wks… Megan’s enlightened readership thought that the doctor was an idiot, rather than Megan being a forgetful twit who could not keep her story straight.
    This week Megan posted the ultrasound image of a single fetus which she downloaded and pasted from someone else’s blog -and she claimed the image was provided by her doctor.
    At last, even Megan’s deluded readership came to the conclusion she was a fraud…. and then her blog went … poof.

  172. And thanks to CatWhisperer and our old friend Felix who were among those who held her feet to the fire…

    I won’t read it until I get a hard copy but those National Geographic photos are as romanticized and filmy as all the rest of their “foreign culture” coverage. Not one half-finished, tacked-together house in Short Creek in evidence.

    And I sure would love to see Veda Keate’s birth certificate… she’s a very physically-immature 20 year old, based on her face structure.

  173. Thank God for real polyblogs, like Honey Dawn’s!!!

  174. the article sure wouldn’t convince people who are sitting on the fence that these are wholly victimized people

    interesting not a word of child brides in it

  175. My first suspicion that it was a fake came when duane was the first person who posted about the blog. Then “her” description of the first wife bringing the husband and his 18 year old bride breakfast in bed the morning after the honey moon pegged the author as a man having a fantasy. But it’s nice having proof.

    I love it when we’re right!

  176. So much for someone’s fantasy fiction writing effort. Duane do you think?

  177. Gorsh, here’s a photo of Megan herself!

  178. Betty,
    Duane vigorously defended “Megan,” calling me a religious bigot for identifying “Megan” as a fraud last month. Hmm, I wonder what Duane thinks now…

  179. Wait GFNY, I think you just posted a picture of Uncle Bile Medvecky !!

  180. Duane is running out of places he can post without being challenged. His fantasy world is shrinking I have to admit, I do SORTA miss his stupidity. He was such an easy target! But, life is easier without him here causing unneccessary havoc.

  181. Isn’t he still posting over at Honey Dawn’s blog?
    I think I will saunter over there and confront him shortly

  182. Duane thinks?

  183. Stamp, it was a compliment. This is a deep dark subject we discuss here, and lightning it up is a good thing.

  184. Eh, Betty, you do have a point.

  185. Greetings from new york posted the following: “And I sure would love to see Veda Keate’s birth certificate… she’s a very physically-immature 20 year old, based on her face structure.”
    I would agree, interesting that the photo caption mentions her 4 year old son, if her son’s 4, then she would have been 16 when she had the child. Is it her husband that was recently sentenced, Alan Keate? Is this the smoking gun that will kill any chance of Keate appealing conviction? This photo could make Texas AG Gregg Abbott’s day.

  186. A correction, the photo caption mentions Veda’s daughter not son, my bad. “Veda Keate, 20, and her daughter, Sereena, 4, were among more than 400 church members taken into protective custody after a 2008 raid on the FLDS ranch in West Texas.”

    Here’s a link: http://ngm.nationalgeographic.com/2010/02/polygamists/sinclair-photography

  187. duaneh likes to put words in our mouth after he has posed as a ‘Fldstexas’ poster? duaneh claims on this blog people clamor for Winston Blackmore’s arrest for sexual assault of minor girls, even though the real charge would be for trafficking American girls into Canada and exporting Canadian girls into America for ‘plural marriages’? He must have posted for Blackmore to be deported from Canada because he now claims that posters here hold that viewpoint, another of his bogus claims. Am I ‘flaming you’ by speaking the real truth, duh duane?

  188. Cajim

    Its nice they can make any claim without link and without unmoderated response huh?

    Bills Ghetto, the echo chamber of Boneheads.

    Almost every thread has some outrageous unsubstantiated claim.

    It keeps em fired up I guess.

  189. What gets completely overlooked in the context of protecting individual rights of all free Americans is that the FLDS Church makes a practice of exporting American girls into Canada and Mexico and they post no objections, whatsoever. The motivation is to follow the fanatical belief system, dictates of a Felon Prophet and ‘Keep Sweet’ or get kicked out mindset. Rather amazing reality to exist within the borders of these United States.

  190. Yanno

    I dont mind if people are fanatical about something. Its when they start hurting people, esp women and children, then we as a society are responsible to speak out and see that its ended.

  191. A Texan, Veda Keate is Allan Eugene Keate’s daughter. She is “married” to Warren Jeffs — Sereena is his baby.

  192. Well Megans blog is back up

    http://meganspolyblog.blogspot.com/

    and all I can say is Wow, just Wow

    —-

    In a word…..EEEEEWWWWW!!!

  193. OMG MC1199 – I don’t think I have ever laughed this hard.

  194. Tell me that guy doesn’t need Viagra.

    (Greetings spits coffee out her nose.)

  195. That seems like another joke to me, but hey.

  196. Duane has never looked better.

  197. someone has a sense of humor and pretty good computer skills!!!

  198. Was it a guy? or an old woman who looks like an old pervert?

  199. Well all them pictures looked like they placed and posed for the camera in the NG. like the pictures were saying, “See us how normal we are”.

  200. in the joe jessop family picture, that little girl looked like she was saying “do you realize you are all standing in the snow, let’s get back inside where its warm”

  201. So in the Sinclair photo “FLDS members entertain guests with a song at a dairy and alfalfa farm in Beryl, Utah. Portraits of church leaders are in the background.”, when did Marie Musser get sent away from YFZ? She went from pole hugging at YFZ to “entertaining” guests in Beryl.

  202. I cannot answer that, but wonder what photo, did I miss something?

  203. By the way, that isn’t actually Megan’s blog. It’s a different address. Someone is still having a little joke on everyone. ;)

  204. GrannyT, the NatGeo FLDS photo spread has been posted online here is the link:

    http://ngm.nationalgeographic.com/2010/02/polygamists/sinclair-photography

    It is the 14th photo

  205. CaJim, Duane was referring to comments on an article published by a Canadian site “The Province”.

    Rebeckah is correct. That is not megan’s polyblog. The original “megan” took it down.

  206. good eye ladysadie. maybe that’s where raymond’s wives were sent so they couldn’t be subpoenaed to testify.

  207. Regarding the Nat Geo spread

    I agree the photos looked staged. However, despite the claims of lots of access, I’m sure a female photographer was pretty much kept among those prairie dressed females and so that’s reflected in the photographs. I think her inclusion of the picture of Raymond Jessop was her attempt to balance the spread. My opinion is that it didn’t balance the spread and the net message of the spread gave way to much of a Pollyanna view to the lifestyle.

    The text I think was pretty balanced. It pointed out the contradiction that is the FLDS. Yes, on one hand their lifestyle appears quaint, but there is an ugly undercurrent beneath the surface.

    I’m just not sure the text took away enough of the Pollyanna painting of the pictures.

  208. Now why wasn’t Foneta funeral at YFZ? Why?
    The funeral was staged for National Geo.

    Foneta was a free woman when she died, in more ways than one.

  209. I think that there was enough balance to hopefully make a few mainstream people THINK. (That picture of 20 year old whats-her-name with her 4 year old son would be QUITE effective if people paid attention.) But, yes, it’s very subtle and I’m sure a lot of people will miss it. On the other hand, I imagine the readers of National Geographic might just be slightly more discerning than the readers of other magazines. It is something of an educational publication. ;)

  210. Foneta was sent away from YFZ ranch in 2006, she was ill and I guess Merril didnt want to mess with her. No one from the ranch knew where she went.
    Just like Warrens wife Barbara wasnt allowed to go to the ranch until just before she died,, when she begged him to be able to see her children.
    Barbara died at the ranch and is buried there, Fonetas funeral was in short creek, but no one knows exactly where she died.

  211. And Im sorry, but they are a abunch of FREAKIN weirdos

  212. This last Brooke twitter BTW?

    “UT Supreme Court denies FLDS effort to block sale of cows but will hear rest of sect’s emergency petition in February.”

    The Supreme Court denied the entire emergency petition, not just the cow part.

    What the Supreme Court is hearing in February is Rod Parker’s motion to overturn Lindberg’s order disqualifying him and a separate petition to undo the reformed trust.

  213. i read (i think in carolyn’s book) that foneta was sent away and a grandson or something like that found her wandering on the streets and took care of her.

  214. Ron

    Indeed the agenda was to get out the PR machine and show smiley faces. However much of it looked somber and the pic of Raymond, IMHO while her only balance, opens the door to the wandering eye.

    The text failed in vetting the level of crimes though there were some good notes, pointing out that the men were so brow beaten by the leaders that the women were in charge making it a Matriarchal society LOL.

    In truth, I think there are few men and women truly in charge, and those who are face an army of internal unrest.

    Nobody wins.

  215. PT that means she was lied to, A LOT. And/or whored out for access like one or few we know of.

  216. Here is an antidote to pollyanna: an interview with Irene Spencer

    http://www.kfdm.com/news/spencer-36209-irene-texans.html

  217. Another article for your consideration. This one covers in detail the 2004 purge, when Warren kicked out 21 men at a prayer meeting. This articles follows Joseph I. Barlow, where he went and what happened to him. It reveals Warren’s paranoia and hatred toward those men. Also his twisted rationale for taking their families away. See: http://flds101.blogspot.com/2009/05/flds-history-101-2004-purge-and-joseph.html

  218. Anyone know who Leannah Joy Jessop belongs to?

  219. There is an ORS hearing the end of January for Custody and Child support in Judge Beachams court

  220. DD, what day and time is the hearing?

  221. Leannah Joy Pledger until her mom married daniel barlow. don’t know who mom got reassigned to after dan was exed. her mom is hannah cooke. i don’t have her married, but i’ll dig a little and see what i can find.

  222. her sister audrey is married to dee jessop. nothing about her being married to a jessop. possibility she was married to a bistline.

  223. PT, I imangine this HUGE flow chart on a wall, somwewhere in your house. The Who’s Who of the FLDS! A family tree that never ends..just more new branches every day!

  224. close mc1199, its on the computer. i don’t have a wall big enough for this crowd.

  225. If you read the National Geographic story (actually it is referenced in the photo captions) you know that the FLDS owns a 4000 acre alfalfa hay farm in Pony Springs, Nevada. Pony Springs is north of Pioche on Hwy 93.

    If you choose the “satellite” or “hybrid” views on the map at this link, you will see the many circles of alfalfa they are growing. This is a HUGE enterprise that can being in many millions of dollars if the price of alfalfa stays at $100 per ton. Ka-ching!

    http://nevada.hometownlocator.com/nv/lincoln/pony-springs.cfm

  226. I was so hoping that just ONCE I could read an article about the FLDS without hearing from “The Willie”.

    Rats, he made it into the National Geographic story!

  227. ain’t gonna happen anonymous @ 8:20. the only way to shut him up is to put him in jail.

  228. Good Evening,
    I hate to disturb the discussion, but I wanted to request that you sign a petition regarding the increasing sectarian violence against the Coptic Christian Community in Egypt. As you may know, on the Christmas Eve, Muslim extremists gunned down Christians exiting church services. A Coptic physician who works with me told me she left Egypt when several teenage girls in her church were abducted, raped, and forced into temporary “marriages” with Muslim men in an attempt to convert them to Islam. This recent Christmas Eve shooting is but one incident in a growing trend of anti – Christian violence in Egypt, yet neither the President nor the UN has spoken out against the violence. Please consider signing the petition at the link, or attend the Coptic rally at the UN on Tuesday.
    Thanks for your support.

    http://capwiz.com/copticassembly/issues/alert/?alertid=14549671

  229. My goodness knitting at a funeral.

    Congregation at Foneta Funeral photo in the national geographic spread.

    Look at the gal, bottom left.

    I think Ms. Sinclair’s photo speaks volumes.

  230. Yea, anon@9:28 I saw that and had to giggle, LOL. Think it was a command performance? Great photo op, “but dang I really wanted to finish this scarf”, LOL.

  231. good catch. i didn’t notice that before.

  232. i wanna see sinclair’s outtakes, you know, the ones that didn’t make the cut or make it passed wee willie.

  233. January 29, 2010
    1-HR ORAL ARGUMENTS S27 071501596
    State Felony
    STATE OF UTAH ATTY: BELNAP, BROCK R
    FILTER, BRIAN G
    VS.
    STEED, ALLEN GLADE ATTY: BRADSHAW, JIM C
    OTN: 19095116 DOB: 05/12/1981
    F1 – RAPE – 04/14/01

  234. Sorry,
    The rest….
    FIFTH DISTRICT COURT-ST GEORGE
    G RAND BEACHAM January 29, 2010
    Courtroom 3A Friday

  235. thanks info gal!!

  236. For some reason a post I made several hours ago still hasn’t gone thru.

    To see satellite photos of the Atlanta Farms 4000 acre alfalfa hay farm mentioned in the photo captions of the Nat Geo article, go to this link and choose the “satellite” or “hybrid” views in the map provided.

    This farm is in Nevada north of Pioche on Highway 93. With the acreage farmed and the price of alfalfa selling for over $100 per ton, this ranch generates many millions of dollars per year.

    http://nevada.hometownlocator.com/nv/lincoln/pony-springs.cfm

  237. Ain’t no way that hearing is going to be done in 1 hour. Jim Bradshaw will take that long just himself.

    It will take the entire afternoon.

    What are they thinking? Unless it turns into a plea bargaining hearing.

  238. info gal,
    what time does the Allen Steed hearing start?

  239. http://nevada.hometownlocator.com/nv/lincoln/pony-springs.cfm

  240. DD,
    I see an ORS hearing for
    REVIEW HEARING 094500044 Custody and Support ORS
    ATTY: CHRISTIANSEN, RYAN E
    VS.
    COOKE, ESLIE YATES ATTY:
    JESSOP, LEANNAH JOY

    on January 29th with Judge Shumate not Judge Beacham.

    I still don’t see Allen Steed’s hearing with Judge Beacham on Jan 29th. His morning schedule is posted for 2 Bench Trials. Nothing in the PM posted.

    Did they change the hearing AGAIN????

  241. Its on Judge Beacham calendar for Allen Glade Steed. One Hour agruments.

  242. I believe what you are saying – DD

    I just can’t now find the Allen Steed hearing on the current court calendar for Utah’s 5th district court to confirm it.

    I will need to check next week to be sure that it is still on schedule as planned.

  243. I went back to the funeral photo. A lot of them are wearing coats or sweaters even though it’s so crowded, so I’m guessing the building is not well heated. Also there seems to be a lot of boredom; I saw several people who seem to be yawning, one who is leaning her head on someone else’s shoulder as if taking a nap and some who seem to be nodding off. I’m guessing that the have really long sermons?

  244. SNORK

    My guess – they were called to be there for the photo op

  245. i’m sure they were toad. probably a command performance with wee willie knocking on doors threatening people if they didn’t show up.

  246. And that scarf really needed finishing wee willie’s treats or not.

  247. LOL, meant wee willie’s threats (not treats).

  248. Well one thing we know about the White clothing, They get married in white and buried in white, and the wives of the MAN wear white.

  249. A new study in progress in Malaysia indicates that polygamy causes psychological harm to women, children and men as well.
    See the link.

    http://bit.ly/6vx3tC

  250. And they like to take pictures of dead people in their coffin.

  251. A new study in progress in Malaysia indicates that polygamy causes psychological harm to women, children and men as well.

    Interesting. As easy as it is to lay the blame on the men since it’s a patriarchal society, I’ve always believed that wasn’t always all fun and games for them either.

  252. I think that it is the Patriarchal system that would be to blame rather than one or the other gender specifically. Because patriarchy allows men to have more power than women patriarchy leads to all kinds of abuses, from men abusing their power over women and children to women abusing their power over other women and/or children and, of course, to the stress on decent men who actually try to please everyone — an impossible task.

  253. Interesting article…. I think that the system screws everyone unless you are obscenely wealthy and can pay some one to keep track of everything for you (which wives birthday it is, whose anniversary it is etc….)

  254. I read an article by a male journalist who said that the problem with polygamy is that all men put themselves in the place of the man with 12 wives and no one imagines themselves as one of th 11 men who have no wife. It is a basic of pyramid schemes is that the urge to move up or to keep from falling to the bottom of the hierarchy is what keeps people compliant. People see themselves or their oppressor as the problem rather than question the system overall.

  255. So far, I have accumulated about 50 articles regarding the negative effect of polygyny on women and children. All of these studies have similar findings, no matter which cultural or religious group is studied. Now research indicates that polygyny has a negative effect on men as well.
    Based on these findings, I believe that polygamy should never be legalized. My belief is not based on opinion, conjecture, religious belief or prejudice. Polygamy should not be legalized due to the MEDICAL AND SCIENTIFIC FACT that it has a negative effect on the family. It is that simple for me.

  256. My goodness knitting at a funeral.

    Congregation at Foneta Funeral photo in the national geographic spread.

    Look at the gal, bottom left.
    ———
    Considering that most of the people in the photo seem to be glaring directly at the camera (i.e. at Stephanie Sinclair), I think this photo must have been staged either before or after the actual funeral service, not during.

  257. maybe stephanie is standing right behind the casket or right next to the bishop performing the service. Wonder how long the service was.

  258. Actually, I think she’s probably standing in the same spot as when she took the photo of Merril in front of the casket and the receiving line – something like a balcony in the back corner of the meeting room.

    I found the open casket photograph rather unsettling.

  259. What is the pic above Fonetta in the casket about? Who is that?

  260. Two possibilites, anon 5:59.

    It’s either Foneta and her father or Foneta and Merril.

    The head isn’t short and squat so I would guess that it isn’t Merril.

  261. texastwist: I can’t make it out, either, but I think it could also maybe be Foneta & Warren.

  262. gag me with a spoon

    http://www.stltoday.com/blogzone/civil-religion/mormonism/polygamy/2010/01/reporter-brooke-adams-and-coverage-of-polygamy-in-the-salt-lake-tribune/

  263. i think its foneta and her oldest son, fred, jr.

    notice kathleen, she still has a smirk on her face. is that babs in the front?

  264. wonder if sarah draper made the trip from abilene?

  265. it’s foneta holding a picture of merril.

  266. the one at the foot end of the casket has to be fred jr, i’ve seen pictures of nathan carter and video of richard samuel and it isn’t them.

  267. isnt it lyle jeffs

  268. i don’t know, i just read in the article that her 3 sons lined up on one side of the casket with merril and his wives on the other side of the casket.

  269. just kinda looks like him from far off, guess not

  270. i don’t know what lyle looks like to say it is or it isn’t.

  271. http://www.photoshelter.com/search/search?I_DSC=lyle+jeffs+flds&I_DSC_AND=t&I_CITY=&I_STATE=&I_COUNTRY_ISO=&I_IS_RELEASED=&I_IS_PRELEASED=&I_ORIENTATION=&_CB_I_PR=t&_CB_I_PU=t&_CB_I_RF=t&_CB_I_RM=t&I_SORT=DATE&_ACT=search&F_REFINE=t

  272. I think it’s very odd to have the receiving line right next to the casket. In the funerals I’ve been to, you have the casket in one area, which is quiet and solemn, and then the family gathers elsewhere to greet people. It’s disturbing to me. It’s almost like a wedding reception line. My feeling, looking at this photo, is that it’s disrespectful of the deceased. Also the individuals who go up to view the casket have no privacy for their emotions.

    I’m just wondering if anyone else has seen a funeral done in this way.

  273. Betty: I think it’s very odd to have the receiving line right next to the casket. In the funerals I’ve been to, you have the casket in one area, which is quiet and solemn, and then the family gathers elsewhere to greet people. It’s disturbing to me. It’s almost like a wedding reception line. My feeling, looking at this photo, is that it’s disrespectful of the deceased. Also the individuals who go up to view the casket have no privacy for their emotions.

    I’m just wondering if anyone else has seen a funeral done in this way.
    …………………………

    Well, that’s the way they do it, I guess. I find it quite creepy myself, but each to their own.

    Everybody in my family chooses cremation. We scattered my dad’s ashes at sea; it seems so clean and free. I don’t want my body to rot away in a box underground. Gross.

  274. i’m with you betty. a lot of funerals i’ve been to have had the burial first with just family and then a memorial service at the church afterwards. that’s how we did my dad although a lot more than just family attended the burial, which was alright.

  275. i wonder if they take pictures of all the dead bodies.

    and is foneta in some room with babs waiting for merril?

  276. I’m not sure when the custom of photographing the dead died out here in the US, I guess by about the 60s it was way less common. I suspect that about by the Civil War and photography becoming more available that began. Not that everyone did it, families varied.

  277. “and is foneta in some room with babs waiting for merril?”

    Yes, and she’ll be waiting a long, long time. Like an eternity.

  278. “it’s foneta holding a picture of merril.”

    Yeah, that’s what it is.

    Oh, puke.

  279. like photographing the dead, i’ve never understood their obsession of taking pictures of people holding photographs.

  280. The disgusting photo thing is showing her king marrill.

    I met a girl in the 1950s who carried her photo of her baby that died, and also fingernail clippings and a clip of hair. Kept what she could close. Some other photos I saw were most often of dead grannies or grandpa, a small memorial to soothe the living I guess? O and they used to photograph dead outlaws too.

    In other countries around the world you’ll still see graphic and lurid pics right on the newspaper front page, sensationalizing death. Not always places like South or central America either, one could look at Dutch Antilles / Aruba; maybe it sells papers. I look for free online heh but it’s not those lurid death photos, I read some of the languages down there.

  281. I used to have a photo of the grave site of my sister. She died in France and I did not get to go to the funeral. I think the photo for me was to make her death real in my mind so that I could start to accept it. Once I had a chance to visit the gravesite, I threw the photo out. It’s just a block of marble, it’s not her, you know? So I don’t mean to criticize how anyone handles their own personal grief, it just seems to me that from this photo that the FLDS are carrying their own warped view of the individual into the funeral ritual. Even after death, poor Foneta has no individual indentity, only one more woman in matching clothes grouped around Merrill. I find it very sad.

  282. It’s interesting attitudes and customs about death vary so much between cultures. There is even large differences between how Christian churches handle things.

    I was pretty good friends with one of the coroners down in Galveston County. Man he had some fascinating, but perhaps gruesome stories.

  283. Interesting indeed,

    What this funeral says to me is that Foneta was Merrils property and if you wanted to see her you had to go through Merril.

    And of course she is holding a pic of him so everybody wouldnt make the mistake of who was her owner in life and afterlife.

    Yes, that does appear to be Lyle in the Lower RH corner.

  284. That’s the way I read it also, Stamp.

  285. Just a head’s up if you post on Bill Medvecky’s blog. Not only does he alter the content of posts – adding his own words – but also his disclaimer when collecting your email address: Your email is never published nor shared. Required fields are marked * is false. He just published the email address I filled in that field with. If you are tempted to post there be aware that nothing he posts there can be trusted.

    (He is now trying to claim that his disclaimer refers to the content of an email rather than the address. lol)

  286. Ooops, sorry, I’m anonymous. I cleared my cache and forgot I’d have to reenter my information.

  287. I’m really surprised that the family allowed this picture of the deceased to be published for all the world to see. I would not have wanted that for my own parents’ funerals. Did the family give their permission? And did Barbara have a funeral like this also?

  288. I just wonder if they had the same type of funeral for Babs.
    Now, her I could see clutching a picture of Merril.

  289. I hope this inspires the tale of Foneta’s life to get out.

    The sad, abused, rejected life of Foneta, who gets this big party on her passing.

    Was it a celebration? Or Merrils last “Hurrah” before he goes to trial?

  290. how many wives does he have?

  291. Linda, I’m assuming that the Nat Geographic would not show the photo without appropriate legal signoffs.

  292. Just a head’s up if you post on Bill Medvecky’s blog. Not only does he alter the content of posts – adding his own words – but also his disclaimer when collecting your email address: Your email is never published nor shared. Required fields are marked * is false. He just published the email address I filled in that field with. If you are tempted to post there be aware that nothing he posts there can be trusted.
    …………………………

    I am wondering if he is “40andnotmarried” who posts in the Trib forums. That person is filled with hate and rage against law enforcement, and obsessed with the hoax phone call – claims it was attempted murder.

  293. That’s a possibility, Anon E. Mouse, but I think it’s pretty slim. My “gut” says that only a woman really cares if she’s 40 and not married enough to make it a screen name. It’s a pretty sad commentary on her personal sense of self worth too. I mean, I’m 47 and not married but I don’t consider it to be even remotely descriptive of who I am as a human being. ;)

  294. Okay, I just added my website — does it change anything about my signature or anything?

  295. Oooh, it did! I’m so excited now. :D

  296. You could be right Rebeckah – but you don’t usually see women with so much hatred towards authority figures. Of course that Deb Lee is female and she wished a gunman would open fire in the courtroom.

    My gut tells me that people so vehemently defending the right of grown men to have sex with young girls must have some kind of twisted sexual desires of their own.

  297. Absolutely agreed Anon E. Mouse.

  298. Deb Lee claims we must have a secret yearning because we a preoccupied with discussions about sex with minors. This, of course, overlooks the fact that the FLDS ‘Dirty Dozen’ nine men of whom are charged with sexual assault of a minor. Kind of tough to discuss the Grand Jury indictments which are about raping girls and not discuss ‘sex with minors’.

    Another airhead comment from ‘Cupcake’ on Bill Medvecky’s blog that stands without correction nor disagreements. Duh! Cupcake we are the KS faction that has said since day one that sexual abuse was present, condoned and criminal acts on the YFZ Raunch and it doesn’t have anything to do with it being a preoccupation but rather a series of heinous felonies imported from Utah. Has more to do with the fact that yet other FLDS Church Priesthood members had been tried/convicted in Arizona the year before but you label us incorrectly and Bill approves.

  299. i’m guessing babs might not be waiting with foneta either. she’s probably in the same place merril will end up.

  300. My gut tells me that people so vehemently defending the right of grown men to have sex with young girls must have some kind of twisted sexual desires of their own.

    Sometimes I suspect our buddy Duane falls into this category.

  301. When I posted on Bile’s I put in a phony email address and it was happy with it and let me post.

  302. Are you kidding? FLDS would sell their souls to the devil, if it meant getting the publicity they need. And NO, barbara’s funeral wasnt even talked about, no obituary, nothing. Babs was Merril’s fav when it came to wives, so naturally her funeral was “private”.
    Foneta was burr in merril’s butt, no love lost, therefore it was okay to have gentiles at her funeral, taking pictures.

    “Aunt Nita Jessop was sent away from her family and grandchildren through the regime of Warren Jeffs. She has been with Merril Jessop since she was young, and now that she is old and in ill health, she is sent off with no one to care for her except for a compassionate teen-age grandson.

  303. Her name was spelled Fawnita.

  304. Fawnita was sent away from YFZ ranch in 2006.

  305. That’s exactly how I see it. One last abusive slap at Foneta by turning her funeral into a Nat Geo dog and pony show.

  306. OK, DD, make that Fawnita. If the poor woman has to have her picture in a national magazine in her casket, at least we can honor her by spelling her name right.

  307. Well its for sure Merril didn’t look bereaved in the picture standing there by her casket, smiling , shaking hands.

    My understanding of all FLDS funerals, is they are private, and many times even family members are refused to attend.
    Those who speak of the deceased, stand up and basically attack the dead person, like gossiping about what harrible lives they lead, how unworthy they were and God took them home because of it.
    It’s like SEE how this person lived,, Be sure and don’t live like they did.

  308. Funny, and most of the funeral’s I’ve been to, they do the opposite. They make up some kind of fairy tale about how wonderful the person was to the point where even those who really loved them can’t recognize them from the sermon.

    I’ve been to some really beautiful wakes where people shared photos, poems, told happy stories of the deceased, etc. but those were usually small and private.

  309. Foneta, Fawnita, Faunita… I don’t think anybody know how it was supposed to be spelled, just how it was supposed to sound.

  310. knows, knows. Dear Admin, can we have an edit button, please?

  311. lol rattle :)

  312. My husband has conducted many funerals when there was little that could be said good about the departed. He would then aim at encouraging the remaining family and friends to make the most of life and to put their faith in Christ and live as He taught. As for me – I dont care to have a funeral. Just a quiet memorial service for family and friends to share is quite enough. After all these years my husband agrees with me! So we will probably shock some folks, but thats ok.

  313. Linda, regardless, there were those who loved this woman, and there were those who loved warren’s dead wife barbara, annette jeffs sister.
    If you read warren’s dicatations about his “speech” at his dead wifes funeral, you would know he was an ignorant callius person the way he talked about her.
    They claim to be loving people, who adore their families,, but as we have seen over and over again, in the LEADERS own handwriting, that is NOT the case. To stand up in front of people and belittle someones dead mother, sister, grandmother, is just cruel.

  314. Trust me if the NG hadn’t been doing this story on FLDS, the funeral wouldn’t have been this large, nor this flashy. It was a SHOW linda, that was its only purpose.

  315. DD, I wanted to read that part of the dictation but never have been able to find it. Could you point me in the general direction? Thanks.

  316. Miele, I think it’s on page 53 of the dictations here:

    http://texasflds.files.wordpress.com/2009/02/jessop-22.pdf

  317. ellie, thank you very much.

  318. #

    wonder if sarah draper made the trip from abilene?

    ProudTexan said this on January 17, 2010 at 9:12 PM

    Sarah Draper is nuring in Sonora, now.

  319. Anyone who defends the FLDS is a suspect pervert.
    Good to see you are back Ron. Some of us were worried about you after that heated exchange with Boots.

    Well, actually, any attempt to reduce me to such black and white is bound to fail. Boots is dangerous. She’s a zealot. Zealots of any kind whether religious zealots who believe that teens are fair game or law and order zealots who believe that we should just “round them up” are equally dangerous.

    Although, somehow anonymous, you remind me of this guy I know named Duane.

  320. who runs short creek now?

  321. Foneta Marie Cook Jessop

  322. i believe it’s lyle jeffs.

    and i heard about sarah draper being back at the ranch after i posted the question. i had hoped that she had seen the light and would stay in abilene.

  323. Isn’t Sarah Draper the ob gyn nurse ?

  324. who runs short creek now?

    Anonymous said this on January 18, 2010 at 9:48 PM

    Foneta Marie Cook Jessop

    Info Gal is RIGHT. Foneta runs Short Creek. National Geographic Magazine confirmed it. I saw the photos!
    info gal said this on January 18, 2010 at 10:17 PM

  325. well he doesn’t have any underage wives

  326. DRAPER , SARAH
    SONORA TX 76950
    Texas Initial Licensure Date:
    9/16/2008
    Licensure Status:
    CURRENT – 6/30/2011

    Compact Texas License:

    YES
    Current Disciplinary Action (if applicable):
    NONE

  327. Isn’t Sarah Draper the pretty lady who was once a “wife” of ex-Colorado City Mayor Dan Barlow, Sr.

    Or do I have her confused with somebody else?

  328. Thanks anonymous 10:30 pm, that is what I thought.

  329. Anon 10:38,

    You have it right.

  330. In 2007, Sarah Draper’s mother and her grandmother were at YFZ listed as “Guests” in Wendell Nielsen’s household. Possible they are both still there or back. It seems like I did see one of their names in a past article as one of the older women in Westcliffe, Colorado.

  331. is Sarah practicing at YFZ, or in Sonora, as the licensing documents indicate?

  332. I have been reading the dictations that were posted a day or so ago,

    http://texasflds.files.wordpress.com/2009/02/jessop-22.pdf

    On page 22 of that document, Jeffs talks about the accusations that he sexually molested Shem Fischer and others. His wording is very, very strange. (Yeah, I know. It’s all strange.) His wording in one sentence sounds like he is saying that he did it; “these boys are going to testify against me for sexually molesting them” and had seen a lawyer who prosecuted a Catholic priest “who had done that”. Then in another sentence he calls the accusation “these so-called wrongs” and talks about how the men are lying because of their own guilt in having sex with each other.

    I had dismissed these accusations as being exaggerated and uncorroborated. But the above wording sounds to me that Jeffs is not saying he didn’t do it; he’s saying that when he did it, it wasn’t wrong! I realize that the dictations at this point are not clear and certainly are not a confession, but you would think that an innocent person would have used different words. For instance, wouldn’t you say that someone was going to testify “that I molested them” instead of testifying “against me for sexually molesting them”? Between that and the refusal to face the accusation in court, I’m more inclined to believe that he is guilty, but believes that since he’s the voice of God on earth, when he gives his special attention to someone, they should be grateful.

  333. Same dictation, a few pages down on page 29. He is talking about instructing a man named Nathan on how to handle it when a man and a woman come to him and have accusations against Warren. Warren says, quite clearly, that a woman has the Holy Spirit if she confesses her own crimes, but does not (and thus should not be believed or taken seriously) if she accuses someone else of crimes. So, basically, he is saying any accusation from a woman against any one else is a sign that she is unworthy. It is an admission of sin to report a rape or beating or lack of financial support. Explains a lot, doesn’t it?

    I better go focus on my own tasks instead of reading this dark and disturbing work any longer or I will be overwhelmed by it.

  334. Miele – you’re welcome! I noticed on page 54 of the same document, Warren Jeffs says (concerning the funeral for his “wife” Barbara Jeffs):

    “I had the brethren go up to the grave site and then I had the family gather and we took pictures of myself and her children, principally, and then myself and a few ladies with Barbara in the casket.”

    So apparently casket pictures are not an unheard-of practice.

  335. Excellent post, Betty!

  336. but believes that since he’s the voice of God on earth, when he gives his special attention to someone, they should be grateful.

    You mean its not clear by now that the FLDS think getting screwed by Warren Jeffs is an honor?

  337. I think it’s spelled out very clearly, Ron. LOL!

  338. “You mean its not clear by now that the FLDS think getting screwed by Warren Jeffs is an honor?”

    It clear that they’d BETTER think it’s an honor – otherwise they’re apostates, right? In which case they never really got screwed at all and are just lying. ;)

  339. but believes that since he’s the voice of God on earth, when he gives his special attention to someone, they should be grateful.
    ………………
    You mean its not clear by now that the FLDS think getting screwed by Warren Jeffs is an honor?
    ……………………

    Too bad all he gets now is a lonely prison cot, instead of the white celestial bed on the temple altar.

  340. How did Merrianne get the missing baby anyway? We know from the lie FLDS told the Utah Supreme Court Justices that AI is unacceptable. Was that a set up? Warren either did or did not have sex with and impregnate that child.

  341. Hmmm, someone on Bile’s block was claiming TexasFLDS was hacked. Since a post I just made here is gone, I’m wondering if it’s true.

    Oh, and Megan’s back, if you’re interested. Her blog is now “by invitation only” ;)

    http://www.blogger.com/profile/08759492435394288955

  342. I’m guessing he didn’t.

  343. Hmmm, someone on Bile’s block was claiming TexasFLDS was hacked. Since a post I just made here is gone, I’m wondering if it’s true.

    I wouldn’t put too much stock in that rumor. I’ve had lots of comments go to the bit bucket in the sky.

  344. Regarding other blogs:

    Honey Dawn – real polygamist or fake site?

    I vote fake.

  345. lol, you are quite right, Ron. And Bile’s site is hardly a source of truth OR light. :D

  346. lol, I think it’s for fun and I think it IS fun. At least it’s lighthearted. ;)

  347. I definitely think HoneyDawn’s blog is fake. But it’s fer cute, as HoneyDawn would say. She’s the sunny face of polygamy!

  348. I love Honey Dawn. She is such a blessing.

  349. Yes, I saw that the lovely “Megan” and her polyblog is back.
    No doubt she has a bridge she would like to sell us.

  350. I vote fake on the Honey Dawn issue.
    But even if legit, personally, I find her offensive and was appauled when she referenced Martin Luther King, as Marin Lucifer King.

  351. Also, Honey Dawn’s spelling errors ‘out her’. She’ll miss spell a word one day and spell it correctly the next. I think her illiteracy is an act to lend crediblity to her agenda. If she has the intellect to set up a blog, certainly she can figure out spell check.

  352. I vote Miss Honey Dawn is a fishing expedition.

  353. I thought some things were obviously fake to the most casual observer, but then again, you would think that of some religious leaders.

  354. ah, cement, welcome back. happy new year to you.

  355. Betty, when these first went up either my computer wouldn’t load them, or I was busy and intended to get to them later. So this is my first time reading them.

    You’ve hit on some very astute behavioral observations. I haven’t gotten to where you are yet, but it sounds to me like you’ve decoded the essence of a sociopath. Whatever they do is not wrong. If the Child(id) desires to have sexual relations with a little boy, then it must be the Lord commanding it. (No Adult editing.) When it sinks into your mind how these personalities operate it makes you want to puke.

    When you remember he had all these malleable young minds and bodies to mess with at the Alta Academy, it make you want to double puke.

    I skipped around in reading it because I wanted to see how he was ordering things. In this set of dictations it seems the states he perceived as Mormon persecuting got dissed first. He liked that feeling of power. To distract his flock from the idea that he was on the lam, he came up with a forty eight state mission.

    Reading about his shenanigans in Independence put me in my own heavenly session. The Lord told me to got this way, no, that way! Go across the river, no back! Hey! I’m in Warrenton! No wonder he finally bought a GPS.

  356. ellie, Yes, I think pictures of people in caskets are a throw back to days gone by.

    My mom had an album that belonged to my grandmother. In it there was a picture of her mother in a casket. Not one, mind you, taken by a brownie box camera, but by a professional photographer.

    I freaked. My mom said, “Calm down, it was the way things were done back then.”

  357. I am a cameo collector. I have a “funeral cameo” of a young woman who passed away at the turn of the last century. The background of the funeral cameo is composed of onyx, with the likeness of the deceased young woman in ivory.
    It is set in an ornamental silver / marcasite frame.
    Funeral cameos which contained the likeness of the deceased were all the rage until approximately 1930 in NYC.

  358. Well, Cat – thanks for that, and BTW that’s the right time frame.

  359. INO, HoneyDawn is a fake and a spoof. Whether mho is correct or not; I am struck with how childish the “wives” are on that blog. Their main concerns seem to be christmas presents, improper dress, reading a nonapproved book, what craft things to do, etc. The “husband” Pratt is the father that intervenes and makes everything right again. His interaction with the women is more like a father interacting with juvenile children than 2 adults interacting. JMO.

  360. I would love to meet whoever is behind HoneyDawn. Whoever it is has one heck of a sense of humor and is funny as hell.

  361. I’ve said before, I keep waiting for someone to jump out and yell “GOTCHA!”. If Honey Dawn is real, she is a 50+ yr old women with a 12yr old writing style. It reminds me of entries that should start with…’Dear Diary”. And Pratt…well, don’t get me started there. It seems HD is more intent on gossip and tattling on her sister wives, than much else. I find her reallly annoying and silly. ‘Nuff said on the subject.

  362. mc1199: It appears that we are in agreement. Silly and annoying are probably terms better than immature and shallow, but are in the same vein.

  363. Honey Dawn is the Saturday Night Live skit of polygamy blogs.

  364. I would agree that Honey Dawn’s blog is a spoof – but at least Honey Dawn is not attempting to recruit 18 – 21 yr olds to a polygamous, pseudo – Christian patriarchal commune in California, unlike one other recently “privatized” blog did.

  365. The site was not hacked, although it gets glitchy once in a while.

  366. So, just another lie from Bile M. Just like the bavarian creme filled pastries he was eating at a non existent bakery. Just like he is in constant contact with the yfz compound to coordinate atrategy. ROFL

  367. Miele,

    I read a lot of them when they first came out, but there are so many.

    Another sociopathic thing he does is to get people to change what they are doing for no logical reason just to see if they obey, and he obviously really enjoyed it.

    I enjoy small doses of Honey Dawn. There is a certain truth in any satire. But it gets old pretty fast.

  368. Well, to be perfectly honest, the nom de plume of the gossiper wasn’t, Bill. Now it could have been a sockpuppet, but I imagine it was just a syncophant trying to score points. ;)

  369. lol, sycophant — don’t ask me why I stuck a “n” in there.

  370. So, just another lie from Bile M. Just like the bavarian creme filled pastries he was eating at a non existent bakery. Just like he is in constant contact with the yfz compound to coordinate atrategy. ROFL

    ………………………

    WTF? Is he hoping for an invitation? Maybe get a free log house, complete with newly assigned wives and a fesh batch of children?

    Seriously, even the boneheads in charge of the YFZ wouldn’t be so stupid as to link themselves publicly with that idiot.

  371. Barbara was too smart to speak to him. I rather imagine he disgusts most of the FLDS, but they’re willing to give lip service to the idea of friendship if it gets them free PR. Of course having someone like Bile trumpet your cause really makes you look terrible, but interbreeding hasn’t done wonders for the average intelligence of the average FLDSer.

  372. Betty you’re right about that. I want to go through them all. I can see now why people need spread sheets to keep it all straight. For satire, I prefer Mark Olsen and Will Sheffer the writers of Big Love. M. Olsen does all his own research, and he comes up with some dillies. This week he had a character that had no fingernails. Sure enough, a google search found an article on Rick Ross that said one of the Kingston’s genetic deformities were children born having no fingernails.

  373. Honey Dawn — a funny as hell parody.

  374. I don’t get HBO, so I’ve never seen Big Love.

  375. If you have a Netflix account you can get all the past seasons of Big Love.

  376. I like Honey Dawn, but that is because I know it is a parody, right down to the mispellings (go look at Texas Polygamy). It is sort of like reading the comics – where is she going to take her tattling, will she have one of the sister wives rebel and leave, when will the sister wives beat up on her for being such a jerk.

  377. Well they did leave her that LOVELY jar of honey during the camping trip. :)

  378. Does anybody know anything of Charlene wall Jeffs?

  379. I wonder if there will be another prophet..

  380. Will there be another prophet.. after Jesus? NO.

  381. I concur with you, JonDana

  382. Thanks, JoDanna, I’ll check that out!

  383. Aren’t we about due for another trial? Who’s up next?

  384. Michael George Emack. His trial begins on January 25 in San Angelo.

  385. I love HoneyDawn to bits.

    But I do question the intelligence of anyone who takes her blog seriously.

    I can detect two distinctly different writing styls in it (although the atrocious spelling and grammar is consistant). Has anyone else noticed that?

    Melissa

  386. I’ve noticed that HoneyDawn has configured her site so you can’t exit. It clicks you back on 4x’s before exit. I’ve suspected it’s some method to increase her site stats for more ad revenue. Each view turns into 5.
    In that regard…she’s just like the flds. A cheat.

  387. This is a comment to an article on the SanAngelo Standard Times.
    So funny, just had to share.

    rw6#207170 writes:
    Hmm.it doesn’t seem like any FLDS avenging angels are even trying to show up during the trials.Anyone seen even a feather?
    .

  388. Well Bile Mudpuppy says he sent my “information” to “the ranch” so I’ll let you know if anyone tries to harass me. (Frankly, I believe even the FLDS have better things to do.) ;)

  389. Frankly, I believe that Mudpuppy’s has zero access to the ranch.

  390. I fully agree with you Betty. Bile’s ego is almost as big as Huge Ego McBryde’s

  391. Question: Brooke Adams is supposed to be this big expert on the FLDS, but she seems to be ignoring the treasure trove of information available in Warren Jeffs’ dictations.

    She seems to want to portray Wee Willie and crowd as just ordinary folks trying to get along, and in some respects that is true – all those mothers have to get up every morning, change diapers, make breakfast, just like a million other mothers do every morning; as a mother I understand that.

    But Warren IS the FLDS, it ALL goes back to him, nobody pops a zit without his permission, let alone choose whom they marry – and his dictations are the ramblings of a delusional religious fanatic who believes himself to in a holy war with the US government.

    Hello journalists? This isn’t relevant?

    Yes those modest prairie dresses are all in pretty pastel colors, but is there no recognition that those colors were chosen by a man whose visions of America’s destruction are remarkably similar to Osama bin Laden’s?

  392. I used to think that Brooke Adams glossed over a lot of the evidence of criminal activity (including Warren Jeff’s dictations) because she was trying to maintain important, exlusive contacts with FLDS members.

    Like, she didn’t want to risk offending and alienating her contacts by publishing things that would make Warren Jeffs and/or the FLDS “look bad.”

    However, she never seems to have the inside scoop on any situation so I really don’t get it.

  393. Mouse

    I agree with you that there’s not much difference between Warren Jeffs and Osama bin Laden.

    It’s just that Warren’s wackiness is below a certain level where it doesn’t get widespread attention.

    For example:

    1. They only marry young girls from inside the sect. While that’s egregious enough, if they were recruiting females off the street it would be vastly different.

    2. He’s perfectly content to wait for God to bring about whatever destruction he thinks going to happen. If he were trying to help things along again things would be vastly different.

    3. Most of the other wackiness is pretty well hidden and therefore trickles out bit by bit. It’s not like some sudden large crime wave that gets people’s attention.

    So, I think for the vast majority of Americans they aren’t overly concerned about the FLDS.

  394. In that regard…she’s just like the flds. A cheat.
    ===============================================
    I thought HoneyDawn was one of those Anti FLDS nuts?

  395. Yes, the vast majority of Americans aren’t overly concerned about what happens inside the closed society of the FLDS. It’s not like we don’t have hundreds of other important issues to worry about.

    Too bad the tabloids aren’t more interested – men having sex with underage girls and/or their stepdaughters is front page news if they’re named Roman Polanski or Woody Allen.

  396. Most of the time, even death in Flds community is secret, unless its a leader. they rarely print an obituary in a newspaper.

  397. Mouse, Brooke posted the dictations when the first came out and got slammed for it.

  398. I do think Brooke Adams tries to not alienate her FLDS sources. However, I think that has caused her to lose favor with other folks so that in the end her reporting suffers.

    I know a lot of folks think she’s biased pro-FLDS but Bill Medvecky would greatly disagree. So, my take is that when both sides think you’re biased then you must be somewhere in the middle.

  399. Mouse, Brooke posted the dictations when the first came out and got slammed for it.

    ………………………..

    Oh I didn’t know that. Who slammed her and why? I have to say that many of her articles that I have read seem to be fairly even handed, but since she allows the posters to slander Carolyn Jessop in her blog, it just feels to me that she leans in the “they are being persecuted for their religion” direction.

  400. Ron

    While Bill feels that way, well, just remember thats Bill – the guy who got his hand burned off as a child by an angry lesbo dyke.

    Brooke is sloppy enough though, and her posting a link showing a tabloid pic of Warren as “BAT BOY” really riled the FLDS and they left in a huff all pissed off. (and still holding that grudge, Ive seen posted)

    Since then they have been angry with her. Regardless, she has propped them up with pro-spin MOST times, even when there is bad news. This could be compiled into a large volume, well it kinda is on her poly wog page.

    Most informed comments would disagree with her POV and missed details though.

    An example is the complete lack of reporting on Allan Keates conviction and sentencing. She gave one freaking TWEET.

    How’s that for a freebie, throwing the FLDS’ worst conviction for child rape ever under the rug and keep it mum!!

    She is the best thing they got and they are mad at her.

    But hey – thats life in FLDS land!!

    But the SLTrib is bleeding more red ink than the FLDS right now, the parent company filed bankruptcy to the tune of 930 MILLION dollars.

    Not enough “Truth in Polygamy Reporting”!!!

  401. Brooke has to come in out of the cold sooner or later, concerning the FLDS Church. Firstly, as Ron points out it is not a 50/50 basis that gets her insider information and coverage. Secondly, as Stamp points out pro-spin can only go so far before more spin becomes odorous and tough to pass the smell test. Lastly, the FLDS Church has gone to Eldorado, Texas to encamp their New Jerusalem which leaves Brooke in a mop up operation with what happens with the UEPTrust and remaining ‘apostates’ and halfhearted followers in Short Creek. I don’t see any resolution to the UEPTrust administration in the foreseeable future. Then how does she cover news of the FLDS Church in Texas from her newsroom in Utah?

  402. “Oh I didn’t know that. Who slammed her and why? I have to say that many of her articles that I have read seem to be fairly even handed, but since she allows the posters to slander Carolyn Jessop in her blog, it just feels to me that she leans in the “they are being persecuted for their religion” direction.”

    What I remember is that Brooke read the dictations themselves and wrote about them, including a few snippets to emphasize her points, and her FLDS readership became angry and refused to visit the blog any more, along with a lot of FLDS supporters.

  403. I wonder, given the Tribune’s financial issues, if Brooke isn’t looking into and pursuing other forms of employment. That would explain a lot of the long silences on her blog. I know that she has a life and does other reporting, but it seems that journalism is loosing it’s ability to support most journalists. Perhaps she is writing a book or simply trying to be non-commital in the hopes that she won’t lose her job if the Tribune ends up under other ownership.

  404. Then how does she cover news of the FLDS Church in Texas from her newsroom in Utah?

    They don’t generally. I think the SL Trib is now relying mostly on local papers and the wire services.

  405. Rebeckah

    During the Keate conviction and sentencing she went silent about it like it didnt even happen.

    The business about the dictations is also true, she just posted a few and gave some commentary, which probably fried the FLDS more than Batboy.

    Of course, adding to that, people post links on her site to this site, with reams and reams of evidence and dictations, none of which match the FLDS Big Lie.

    So theres that too.

    Nifty sites that spew only lies (TruthPrevailed (ha ha) and Mudpuppys site) are what they want to promote – even then, comments are either not allowed or heavily moderated.

    So the fact that someone can go to Brookes blog and speak a truth grates their nerves and they go into a tissy fit.

    TOO BAD SOO SAD.

    But I dont think the fact she allows posters from both sides to post makes her anti-FLDS. I dont consider her pro-FLDS for the fact she allows FLDS lies to dribble from some mouths – I find that an excellent opportunity to Ambush them with Facts.

  406. Ron

    True – the last story was compiled – She hasnt written an FLDS article all year, at least not one in the polygamy file.

    And that Blog has about ground to a halt.

  407. I always guessed the reason for Brook’s soft ball approach was because she’s a Mormon. All who believe the Joseph Smith stuff drink from the same koolaid.

  408. Actually Brooke Adams is not Mormon. If I remember correctly she has stated on her blog that she is Catholic.

  409. JonDana:
    I don;t think all Mormons are drinking the koolaid. I actually know some wonderful people who are Mormons.Could I believe in J.Smith?
    No, neither could I believe in the Pope or his absolute authority.

  410. CM,
    Most Catholics don’t believe in the absolute authority of the Pope either. For Catholics who do believe in the authority of the Pope, the Pope only has authority to speak on matters of faith when speaking “ex cathedra,” which is rarely done.

  411. Actually Brooke Adams isn’t mormon,, she is a “non Practiing” catholic

  412. …a tabloid pic of Warren as “BAT BOY” ….
    I loved that picture!!!

  413. Absolute authority of which Pope? Oh, yeah, the one who got to rewrite the History book and claim the others as posers.

  414. Yeah Betty, I was referring to the Roman Catholic one.

  415. Check this out….
    Huge Ego wants to start his own polygyny run community in the West… I can see it now, Huge Ego playing the role of Warren Jeffs…

    http://www.biblicalfamilies.org/forum2/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=1232#p12167&utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

  416. Yikes!
    Your “Huge Ego” has dreams of taking over a sparsely populated county and starting a retreat for like-minded people.

  417. And then, apparently, take over the town and the town’s services by voting themselves in to office… And I quote…
    “Such a “community” would allow for the take over of county services through elective office, and so on. There is more than one county with such attractive “low population” in Montana, and there are similar places in Wyoming for instance. Petroleum though, is the county with the tiniest population.”
    Hugh McBryde

  418. Of course, he’ll probably go for the higher office….so he can be the MASTER of the ‘like-minded people’. I don’t see him as one to take orders from someone else. He does not play well with others…

  419. Yes, I can see it now.
    Huge Ego playing the role of Warren Jeffs, polygamist sect leader….
    Or playing Alby in big Love.
    It could be a new sit com.

  420. Didn’t he once say that if he were king, he wouldn’t allow women to have any rights?
    Didn’t he say he would re-instate the death penalty for women who committed adultery?
    Hmm, I wonder what the town by laws would look like?

  421. Interesting…NOT illegal for the guys to sleep around, but kill the women they sleep with? Ain’t he a piece o’ work! Good thing he will never be king….except in his own tiny little brain.

  422. Sometimes I think we should wait until about 9PM so we can all tune in to this soap opera or sitcom whatever it is, all at the same time.

  423. Yeah, like Hugh could ever find anyone to stay with him. I have a feeling even his current wife is on her way out soon. Heck, he couldn’t even get along with a church — you have to really work at it to get a church to tell you to go away!

  424. Wow, I just read his posts — what a criminal mindset he has. Basically he’s saying they should claim they live there so they can vote but really live and work where ever and just visit from time to time until they “take over”. I hope someone is keeping an eye on Hugh — he’s really losing it.

  425. The addled, harebrained thinking of a would-be, wanna-be despot. He’d be amusing, if he wasn’t so scarey. Or is that, he’d be scarey if he wasn’t so amusing???

  426. Rebeckah,
    I concur. He is becoming more unhinged by the day.

  427. I just looked at that site.
    It seems that they want to start a polygynous trailer park.
    Well that seems so …. appropriate.

  428. Delusions of grandeur mmm?

  429. Yes, Attila, exactly.

  430. And then, apparently, take over the town and the town’s services by voting themselves in to office… And I quote…
    “Such a “community” would allow for the take over of county services through elective office, and so on. There is more than one county with such attractive “low population” in Montana, and there are similar places in Wyoming for instance. Petroleum though, is the county with the tiniest population

    …………………

    Anybody remember the Bhagwan Shree Rashneesh? aka Osho.

    He tried that in Oregon. Didn’t work. PS Montana does NOT like outsiders trying to take over.

    From Wikipedia:

    In 1981, he relocated to the United States and his followers established an intentional community, later known as Rajneeshpuram, in the state of Oregon. Within a year the leadership of the commune became embroiled in a conflict with local residents, primarily over land use, which was marked by hostility on both sides. Osho’s large collection of Rolls-Royce motorcars was also notorious. The Oregon commune collapsed in 1985 and Osho revealed that the commune leadership had committed a number of serious crimes, including a bioterror attack (food contamination) on the citizens of The Dalles. Osho was arrested shortly afterwards and charged with immigration violations. He was deported from the United States in accordance with a plea bargain

  431. LOL Catwhisperer, are you calling Hugh trailer trash? hehehe!

  432. Anon E, I remember the Baghwan Shree Rashnessh episode in Oregon. He couldn’t have been successful == he didn’t preach polygamy as the path to eternal bliss. That does seem to be the key. (removing tongue from cheek)

  433. Well Connie, I imagine it helps if you’re personable enough that people don’t keep shunning you. Hugh’s only friends are internet wingnuts. Kind of hard to have a “polygamy group” religious or otherwise when no one likes you well enough to be your neighbor.

  434. http://danmorris.com/flds/content/20090729FLDS01908_large.html

    her shoes!?

  435. catwhisperer said: “I just looked at that site.
    It seems that they want to start a polygynous trailer park.”

    heeheeeeeee~~~ thanks for that.

    I’m visualizing a bumper sticker.

    (way too busy with real-work at *this* moment to follow-through) but I’ll certainly take suggestions on possible text.

    …first thoughts:
    “Park n’ Ride with Hugh McBride”
    “Don’t come knockin’ if the trailer’s rockin”
    “We don’t need no stinkin’ badges…”
    ;)

  436. There is one glaring problem with moving to a county with only 500 residents. There are probably really good reasons why no one else lives there. NO JOBS. The idea of a bunch of wingnut religious freaks from all over the US moving to nowhere Montana and trying to survive there is either pathetic or hilarious depending on your view of it. If you could commute into a big city for jobs, then, duh, someone else would have built a gated community and that land would not be cheap anymore. So it would be polygyny for the retired (and now we are into that viagra conversation again) or the independently wealthy with a population of clueless dude ranchers trying to scrape a living off the land serving as the peons. Wait. This sounds familiar somehow.

    Why do people not read the history of other grand experiments? Why assume that you would succeed by doing EXACTLY what others have failed in trying?

  437. I think that is the reason so many of the flds men are in construction. There are not enough jobs in short creek or near the yfz so the men go out of town or out of state to work on projects. Another reason is that you do not need a higher education to grame houses or pour cement. Also a good way to get the teenage boys away from the teenage girls. I suspect it is a good way to hife the or cover the money trail.

  438. Drat: should have been frame houses, not grame houses.

  439. Yes, construction has been a favorite hiding place for organized crime for generations.

    But imagine having 6 wives AND going out of town to work. Insane.

  440. Hilarious – Pathetic – downright assinine on so many levels!

    Hugh’s tin foil hat is tuned into the wrong signal. Does he not hear the message his Church gave him? Has he not ears?

    Yeah, he thought it through, all except the part about Tony Alamo, Warren Jeffs, and Rashneesh (and no one is giving Hugh dozens of Rolls Royces or a million a month in tithes)

    ======

    “If 200 voters registered in Petroleum county Montana, or Arthur county Nebraska, the effect is they would own local government. This then becomes a base of operations, it would also ultimately supply jobs to some of the members of the group.

    I daresay you would own the “Dog Catcher” race, along with the “Justice of the Peace” and the local Sheriff, providing they are elective offices.

    Chances are good you could begin to inhabit county jobs like “ClerK” and DMV positions as well.

    I’ve thought this through by the way :) Hugh McBryde”

  441. “There is one glaring problem with moving to a county with only 500 residents. There are probably really good reasons why no one else lives there. NO JOBS.”

    Which is undoubtedly why Hugh suggested they only visit there two weeks or so a year, which in his fantasy gives them proof of “residence” so they can “vote” and take over the town. What a maroon!

    Does anybody but me find it amazingly ironic that a man who has been bellowing about the “government” infringing on the “rights” of a group of people is now advocating his group take over the government and infringe on the rights of a goup of people who’ve never harmed him or his cyberbuddies?

  442. BTW, IRT Rajneesh, he was deported indeed and died not long afterwards in India.

    The bio attack on the salad bars in The Dalles, OR was at the time and perhaps still stands as the biggest bioterror domestic attack in the US.

    To wit:

    “The 1984 Rajneeshee bioterror attack was the food poisoning of more than 750 individuals in The Dalles, Oregon, United States through the deliberate contamination of salad bars at ten local restaurants with salmonella.

    A leading group of followers of Bhagwan Shree Rajneesh (now known as Osho) had hoped to incapacitate the voting population of the city so that their own candidates would win the 1984 Wasco County elections. The incident was the first bioterrorism attack in the United States, and the single largest bioterrorist attack in United States history.

    The attack is one of only two confirmed terrorist uses of biological weapons to harm humans.”

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1984_Rajneeshee_bioterror_attack

    PS thanks Anon for the “shoes” pic, a detail I may not have noticed. FUNNY! High heels and a prairie dress! Wicked little hussy right there!

  443. Rebeckah

    Whats he gonna tell his wife when he heads out the door for his obligatory two week stint in the boonies?

    “Hey honey, I’ll be back in a couple weeks, gonna do some fly ‘fishing” on the ranch of a friend. If the “fishing” is good I might stay longer! Until the snow starts up whoooo shiver shiver! That place is like lower Arctic!

    But you would be amazed at the amount of young girls errrr people who like to visit! We’ve had three hits on the internet, 40andnotmarried may even show up!”

  444. “Which is undoubtedly why Hugh suggested they only visit there two weeks or so a year, which in his fantasy gives them proof of “residence” so they can “vote” and take over the town. ”

    And what good does that do them? What are they going to improve about their lives if they don’t live where they vote? But I suspect that this is all about ‘winning’ or ‘being right’ in some form or another. Eh. As my local hick sheriff once told me in his rural southern accent “It’s a waste of time to worry about the motivations of crazy people.”

  445. OH, that will work! Leave the young, dumb wife with no work skills in the boonies alone while you commute back to the older, wiser, got a job wife in the big city. How could they all be anything but happy? Cause, like, immature girls do so well raising kids alone with long period with no affection and old wives will never figure out that their pay check is paying for the new wife instead of saving for retirement. What could go wrong, there? Sounds idyllic to me, it’s a wonder everyone isn’t doing it! LOL.

  446. “Such a “community” would allow for the take over of county services through elective office, and so on. There is more than one county with such attractive “low population” in Montana, and there are similar places in Wyoming for instance. Petroleum though, is the county with the tiniest population.”
    ……………………………………….

    There’s a reason some places are sparsely populated.

    Can you see all the women just lining up to move there LOL

    “Come to Bumcluck, Wyoming, where the weather sucks and you’ll be treated like shit by a total loser.”

  447. Hugh wants to be like soul brother Rajneesh.

    Rajneesh had so much going for him, that “Huge Ego, Little Dink” could only dream of.

    Here is a Rajneesh tin foil hat primer so Hugh can catch up with the crazy.

    http://home.att.net/~meditation/wrong-way.html

  448. I think Hugh puts himslf to sleep counting young skirts hopping over the fence into his imaginary 10,000 acre Montana spread.

    ZZZZZZZ………..

  449. Some will read it and some wont. Some will smell the coffee and some wont.

    Remember, about 1,000 people drank Jim Jones poison koolaide, regardless they did so while they saw the first die in agony.

  450. FOUND! BIG LOVE PRE-QUEL!

    “Big Love, the early days”

    Director / producer JAMES CAMERON

    Actor / Singer / Bill Henrickson … errr Paxton

    Shot on LOCATION (Looks like Shortcreek with those frisky residents dont it??)

    Hope you LOL I did!

  451. Stamp, you are one weird dude. LOL.

    Maybe that is a vision of what Warren’s post-destructions Short Creek will be.

    And now we know what inspired him to take motor-sickle riding lessons.

    Yee-haw!

  452. is Stamp a dude or a dudette?
    Just curious…

  453. Cat Whisperer wrote “Yeah Betty, I was referring to the Roman Catholic one.”

    You missed my joke, CW. During at least two times in history, there were two Catholic Popes. The ‘correct’ one, chosen by God, presumably was seated as Pope by the winning side in a bloody conflict. So, which one was infallible and chosen by God? The one with the better army, of course!

  454. C’mon Twist!

    Thought you’d like a little Hollywood from a native son! Fort Worth yanno!

    Catch his accent when he says “Guess this aint your lucky day, Reach! HAAWW!!”

    I’ve followed his career some, seen lots of the Big Love episodes – this really made me laugh, because he is all grown up and businesslike now and this is a throw back 25 years or so..

    The scene where the three cowgirls roped him and branded him was a hoot!

    Of course this is a historical piece, as the only music video James Cameron ever produced.

    Martini Ranch, the band Bill was in, had several other songs and vids, which you may get glimpses of actors including Judge Reinholdt, Michael Bien, Michael Hall and others.

  455. And to top it off the album was called…

    HOLY COW

    Big Love Patriarch Bill Hendrickson always had a way with the ladies..

    Martini Ranch:

    How Can The Labouring Man Find Time For Self-Culture?

    Bill Paxton´s musical project video featuring Michael Biehn, Michael Hall and Rick Rossovich

  456. Cat

    Dude

    Tanks

  457. That last video wierd enough for ya!

    The lack of FLDS connection is abundantly forgiven with the cameo appearance of none other than

    PLIGGY!

    At the end. He waves HI! How friggen cute!

  458. Stamp,
    Thanks for clarifying.

    …and Betty, I wasn’t sure if you were referring to Catholic church and the Pope of Rome Vs. the Pope of Avignon issue, or perhaps the the Eastern Orthodox patriarch vs. the Pope of Rome. Thanks for clarifying – you were referring to the former.

  459. Holy Swine!

    Seriously weird, dude.

    Great stuff.

  460. Weird indeed – but compared to the FLDS? just a different flavor of weird. And beside pliggy, I see other parallels.

    I like the title, which likely has meaning to many a lost FLDS guy:

    How Can The Labouring Man Find Time For Self-Culture?

    The busy work schedule.

    The clapping women who approve of the ‘work’.

    The dizzying pace confounding poor Michael Hall (Weird Science) in a lost time continuem.

    (Hall and Paxton co-starred in “Weird Science” BTW)

    “Am I wrong or am I right?”

    Lots of other good ones.

  461. There was another incident in 1130 when two Popes, Anacletus II and Innocent II were in contention for the Papacy. Anacletus was backed by the Normans in Southern Italy and Innocent was backed by the Holy Roman Emperor. The Normans seated Anacletus with the help of the powerful Roman families who feared invasion from the Germans to the North, and Innocent was declared the pope by the Germans. Anacletus, however, did not live very long (months? can’t remember) and Innocent II was soon declared the Pope. However the Normans were still in such a position of power in Italy that Innocent, who had previously excommunicated King Roger II, validated his coronation which had been previously performed by Anacletus. Church history usually reads these two as being in succession to each other, when in fact, they were for awhile concurrent.

    Yes, I did that off the top of my head, but that’s my time period of interest.

  462. Yes, I vaguely remember the incident you describe, in addition to the Pope of Avignon vs. Pope in Rome fiasco.
    (I am an ex – Catholic)

  463. FLDS member pleads guilty in plea bargin, reports both San Angelo paper reports. Michael Emack plead guilty in exchange for 7 years in prison.

    http://www.gosanangelo.com/news/2010/jan/22/flds-member-pleads-no-contest-child-sex-assault-ch/

    Would be surprised to see Emack turn states evidence as part of plea bargin, IMO.

  464. WHOA!!!

  465. Wow. Was Emack the guy that WSJ referred to in his dictations as the person the FBI called on his cell phone?

  466. B.W.’s lawyers are arguing that it’s just plain ridiculous for a 13-year-old to be prosecuted for prostitution when lawmakers have otherwise determined that a child of that age is legally incapable of consenting to any sex act, much less one that involves an implied contract (minors that age are also too young to legally agree to contracts).

    This story just in, and thanks A Texan

    http://humantrafficking.change.org/blog/view/texas_da_prosecutes_girl_13_for_prostitution_while_her_pimp_32_walks

  467. Here’s Emack in the Tom Green County jail waiting for that white bus to take him to Huntsville, TX to join his fellow crooks Jessop and Keate.

    http://justice.co.tom-green.tx.us/Scripts/UVlink.isa/tgcrisc/WEBSERV/JailSearch?action%253Dview%26track%253D346900

  468. I hope B.W.’s lawyers win — it IS ridiculous to try a 13 year old for such a crime. Now getting him/her into a good treatment facility or youth program might be called for, but jail time is not.

  469. So Emack now has no grounds for appeal, right?

  470. dang, emack’s going to make it to huntsville before keate. go figure. as far as i know, keate is still in schleicher county.

  471. SAN ANGELO, Texas — Michael Emack, 59, a member of the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, pleaded no contest to the accusation of sexual assault of a child Friday, was found guilty and was sentenced to seven years in prison.

    Judge Barbara Walther of the 51st District Court asked Emack if he understood what the plea allowed him to do.

    “I believe it helps me maintain my dignity,” Emack said.

    He also said he understood that it allowed him to appeal. The court recognized that Emack reserves the right to appeal only in certain cases.

    One case regards the lawfulness of search warrants that law enforcement personnel used to raid the Yearning for Zion Ranch outside Eldorado in April 2008 on the basis of what later turned out to be a hoax call of a girl claiming she was abused inside the community.

    “It doesn’t matter the number of children they took or mothers that got on the bus,” FLDS spokesman Willie Jessop said about the raid after the hearing. “What Texas did was wrong.”

    Emack also keeps the right to appeal based on the motion to quash the grand jury indictments alleging that the grand jury system in Schleicher County underrepresented Hispanics.

    “You are giving up your right to a trial by jury,” Walther said. “Do you understand that?”

    “Yes ma’am,” Emack said. The trial had been scheduled for Monday.

    Emack said he also understood he was giving up his right to confront witnesses and his right to remain silent.

    The state, led by prosecutor Eric Nicols, presented documents during the hearing meant to show that Emack sexually assaulted a 16-year-old girl and fathered a child by her in October 2004, and that he had one legal wife and three spiritual wives including the minor.

    Walther had Emack agree to a “waiver of stipulation of the evidence,” saying that the evidence was accurate and could prove the case beyond a reasonable doubt.

    With that evidence admitted, Walther found Emack guilty.

  472. PT,

    Last week’s Success said Keate still in Schleicher County jail awaiting transfer to TDC.

  473. Wow. I’m shocked. The plea probably took years off his sentence though. Smart decision.
    Now, does this mean Warren must have approved of this guilty plea?

  474. “Was Emack the guy that WSJ referred to in his dictations as the person the FBI called on his cell phone?”

    Yep.

  475. Well he is also charged with Bigamy, Which wasnt part of the plea bargain.

  476. So…

    Has Michael Emack joined the ranks of the “half-hearted”?

    Or in other words, has he come to his senses?

  477. What happens to all of their wives?

  478. did anyone call Brooke Adams and give her latest news flash, HAHAHA :)

  479. Are they running bout of money for lawyers? Between TX and UT the attorney bills must be piling up.

  480. Are the other 9 going to get a plea deal?

  481. Thanks, twist.

  482. lol. yea, someone should call Brooke.

  483. Ok, looks like Brooke posted her article approx. 10min ago.

  484. I’m absolutely gobsmacked. Read the Trib story and there wasn’t one Wee Willie Jessop quote.

  485. Emack did a very wise thing in accepting a plea bargain. The tide has been against these guys so far, so he probably got a less severe sentence than he would have had he gone to trial. He reserved the right to appeal on two different points, and he avoided public discussion of his affairs.

    I think admitting his guilt is an important distinction. It may not be the same as acknowledging morally responsibility, but he agreed that he broke the law and deserves punishment. That’s so different than the usual lies and protests from this group.

    Not certain if the state got anything worthwhile in return, but perhaps the judge is mindful of trial exhaustion. I’m thinking of the Subsequent Nuremberg Trials, where sentences were reduced by the High Commission in a misguided backlash of sympathy.

  486. I think the FLDS had no interest in defending him at all, possibly because he was not so high in the ranks. TBM suggested a few weeks ago that the FLDS attorneys were throwing him to the wolves ….

  487. we get leroy is up next for his underage bride. i sure hope we find out whether her 2nd child was a boy or girl.

  488. I wonder if the state has any real intent of pursuing the bigamy charges in the future.

  489. I imagine they do. I wouldn’t rule out more indictments either, once this round of trials is done.

  490. “Don’t come knockin’ if the trailer’s rockin”

    That is really funny

  491. We always said about Wyoming… where men are men and sheep are scared!

  492. Hugh might not want to move to isolated communities in Montana. Rural Montana has a lot of neo-Nazis and skin heads. I don’t think they’d get along with Hugh.

  493. “What happens to all of their wives?”

    I guess that depends on them. According to Warren the FLDS in general is in for hard times — and he’s the one who brought them to that point. But I guess that’s just part of doing the Lord’s work — making the Lord’s faithful followers as miserable as possible.

  494. That “fake baby” Daddy needs his turn.

  495. “Hugh might not want to move to isolated communities in Montana. Rural Montana has a lot of neo-Nazis and skin heads. I don’t think they’d get along with Hugh.”

    Are you kidding?! He says some of them are his good pals! Why do you think his church felt uncomfortable enough to kick him out?

    ————————————

    ADMIN EDIT:

    Hugh was indeed banned from his Church for a threatening internet thread. He did discuss a relationship with a white supremacist and hot linked to him and also to the Freemen in Jordan, Montana group in this same thread.

    This was to send a “not so subtle” message to his Church, evidently the members heard it loud and clear. He was banned, adding to the long list of bannings he evidently continues to experience in life.

    See his thread ominously titled “New Year Revolution”:

    http://hughmcbryde.blogspot.com/2009/12/new-year-revolution.html

    And the Churches response:

    http://hughmcbryde.blogspot.com/2009/12/i-get-boot.html

  496. The Tom Green County Jail website indicates Emack caught the bus for Huntsville, TX at 4:40PM, he was released to the TDCJ, and not freed. Lawdy Lawdy, ole Emacks now singing those Texas prison blues now, riding that white bus to Huntsville.

    http://justice.co.tom-green.tx.us/Scripts/UVlink.isa/tgcrisc/WEBSERV/JailSearch?action%253Dview%26track%253D346900

  497. Sorry Rebeckah, I don’t go read Hugh’s garbage on his blog. I just read what is written about him here.

    I didn’t realize that class of characters were his pals.

    Then, he should have some supporting voters in his take over campaign.

  498. Oh, and I just assumed (bad thing to do) that the Presbyterians kicked Hugh out of their church because he is a nutcase preaching polygamy in New England instead of in Utah.

  499. You know, I would really like to come here to talk about the FLDS. I am not interested in reading untruths about Hugh McBryde. (He was not asked to leave his church because he hangs out with skinheads, he was asked to leave for doctrinal and authority reasons. Geesh.)

    I am passionate about the issue of polygamy and child sexual abuse, but I can’t countenance the childish character assassination. It sullies the soul.

    I visited into another site I like yesterday—one I helped create—with the intention of posting, and it was full of the same juvenile invective. I left without saying a word.

    So choose your poison. If you want me here, then stick to the subject. If it’s more important to make juvenile comments about Hugh McBryde, then so be it. I’ll go elsewhere.

  500. A Texan,
    How long of a ride is it from San Angelo to Huntsville? My geography of Texas is not real good since it is such a big state.

  501. Yes ma’am Greetings, we’ll stick to the subject. Geesh. It’s an open discussion thread.

    I didn’t think it was a childish exchange; I thought it was discussing nutcases who rant about practicing polygamy. Like Hugh in addition to the FLDS.

    But, whatever.

  502. GFNY is correct. It is unethical to float unsubstantiated rumors.

  503. It’s just that I can’t get away from hearing it, and it’s like a teenage clique ganging up on the unpopular kid, no more sophisticated or informed than that.

    I can go on about Wee Willie Winky forever, and I will until he’s also in jail. But he’s a player in this case, so it’s relevant. So, in a way, is Bill Medvecky, since he outed Merrianne’s foster family and is somehow in contact with the FLDS (or likes to pretend he is). McBryde is not a player at all, and his wife is completely unrelated to the story.

    What I find totally weird is the endless speculation about him, his motives, his mental state, his wife, etc. As if he were bloody Tom Cruise and somehow insulated from public opinion by fame and money.

    Frankly it makes me think people need more to do.

  504. Well, I guess some people who read and post on this blog are just captivated/disgusted/or whatever with weirdos like Hugh McBryde and Tony Alamo and Warren Jeffs.

    And ya know, we ALL probably need more to do. Otherwise, what are we ALL doing glued to this blog?

  505. And what is correct is that his church (not ‘the Presbyterians’, BTW) booted him because he is, as Anonymous said, “preaching polygamy in New England instead of in Utah.” You could add, “and he won’t shut up.” The rest is just embroidery.

    I don’t agree with Hugh about this at all, of course. I grieve that he puts polygamy ahead of Christ.

  506. Have at it folks, I’m out of here. Discuss whatever you choose.

    Maybe people will wake up tomorrow in better moods.

    In the meantime, I am going to go jump up and dance because Mike Emack is on his way to Huntsville and the State of Texas saved a bunch of money on legal fees.

    YEAH!!!!!

  507. Actually, Hugh McBryde is as much a player in this issue as Bill Medvecky. McBryde has stalked and harassed Rozita Swinton, to the point that I consider illegal. He has made unsubstantiated allegation against not only Ms. Swinton but also many law enforcement officers in Colorado and Texas. Mr. McBryde has admitted to providing unsubstantiated “evidence” that he made up to Warren Jeffs attorneys. McBryde himself brought his family into the situation by writing about them on his public blog.

    McBryde is as crazy and just as dangerous as Bill Medvecky and Willie Jessop.

  508. And beyond that is is extremely high handed and pompous for a single blogger to come onto a public blog and tell other people what they can or can not blog about. Greetings from New York while your comments are often relevant, well presented and at times highly amusing you are not so “special” that your “threat” to no longer post if all other posters do not fall in line with your orders you will “leave” should in any way deter others from stating their opinions. While your comments will be missed I am sure this blog will survive without your presence.

  509. A song in honor of Emack taking the chain bus to Hubntsville,TX

  510. Don’t you think Mrs. McBryde has enough problems without additional harassment?

    I don’t like Hugh’s fixation about Rozita Swinton any more than you do. But I would be horrified if my own oft-stated observations about this case—some of which are pure conjecture—resulted in public comments about the Tall, Dark and Handsome One.

    There is something to be said for being gracious.

  511. Thank you, A Texan.

  512. Waaal, Ah bleeve Ah’ll join GFNY on the high-handed and pompous side of the line. “Monkey see monkey do” is not a good excuse for anybody to lower him or herself to Hugh’s demented level.

  513. If Mrs. McBryde supports Hugh in his efforts in regards to polygamy as he states on his blog then she is relevant to the discussion.

  514. A Texan,
    How long of a ride is it from San Angelo to Huntsville? My geography of Texas is not real good since it is such a big state.

    Around 327 miles give or take a few. It’s not uncommon for the prison bus to make several stops at various county jails along the way to Huntsville, TX

  515. Well texasrattle isn’t that the beauty of “Open” discussions, you are free to discuss what you want and refrain from discussing things you don’t want to have a part in. What you don’t have the right to do unless you are the Administrator of said blog is to tell other bloggers what they are allowed to discuss.

  516. Edit – no personal attacks – ADMIN

  517. Anonymous 9:19, GFNY didn’t tell you or anybody what you can and/or can’t post about. She posted her opinion, which is supposed to be welcome here on the open discussion thread. Are you telling me it’s okay for you to talk about anything you want to here, but not already for GFNY to do the same thing?

  518. Greetings from New York, no one is asking you to discuss anyone you don’t want to discuss. At the same time no one is telling you what you can or can not discuss. What makes you think you have the right to tell others on this blog what they can discuss?

  519. I repeat myself, Anon 9:26. GFNY did not tell others on this blog what they can discuss.

    It appears that you’re the one who’s doing that.

  520. Who cares what a person who doesn’t sign their posts says? I’m waiting to hear from the real posters, Rattle.

  521. texasrattle here is what Greetings from New York posted

    “So choose your poison. If you want me here, then stick to the subject. If it’s more important to make juvenile comments about Hugh McBryde, then so be it. I’ll go elsewhere.

    Greetings from New York said this on January 22, 2010 at 8:09 PM”

    As if somehow this “threat” to no longer come here is supposed to make other posters to suppress their own opinions. I stand by what I said, while her often times witty remarks would be missed I am sure this blog would survive without them.

  522. Hmmmm, somehow I think Anonymous is just as real as “Greetings from New York”.

  523. Edit – no personal attacks – ADMIN

  524. So are Anonymous posters not allowed on this blog?

    (Yes – but its preferred if you choose a handle – Thanks for keeping it civil – a few other recent posts by others were attacks and have been deleted – ADMIN)

  525. Just as happens everywhere in the blogosphere, people don’t take anonymous posters as seriously as they do posters who sign in with the same identity over time.

    You could be anyone. You could be Hugh McBryde himself for all we know.

  526. ‘night GFNY pleasant dreams, sleep well.

  527. So because I use Anonymous does that make my opinions any less relevant or true than someone that uses a “handle”? Neither are the posters real name both are really “anonymous”.

  528. Thanks, Attila. I just told mah ol’ friend Granny Toad, there was a night a long time ago when we sat watching fish in a Texas lake, drinking wine and single malt whiskey… wondering whether we’d ever see indictments, let alone convictions.

    And I’ve got a bottle of bubbly for all to raise a virtual toast.

    They’re falling! They’re falling like dominos. Prayers answered. Dreams no longer deferred.

    Brava Judge Walther; you’re the best.

  529. Greetings from New York, how is pointing out your threatening other posters is pompous and high handed any more of an attack than you calling other posters “childish”, “juvenile” and telling them they are “sullying” their souls?

  530. An ex plig kid from the AUB :

    http://www.cbs.com/primetime/survivor/casting_call/video_player.php?vid=2549

  531. Good night, GFNY, Rattle, and Attila.
    GFNY, thanks for your offer of assistance, I will be in touch with you tomorrow – there is no one who can turn a phrase as well as you can !

  532. If you wish to substantiate my “rumors” feel free to go read what Hugh said for himself. I got my information from HIS mouth on HIS blog. HE said he was asked to leave because members of the congregation felt threatened by what he said and he added that some of his aryan friends saying such stuff might be threatening but not him. I am a little hurt that you feel I’m just making something up. Feel free to have this forum how you’d like, I can take myself elsewhere.

  533. Ya know….I’ve sat here, time after time, and watched various people discuss, argue, attack, make snide remarks [I’m includng myself] but this IS an open discussion group about the FLDS and it’s related subjects. I had to sit thru, what seemed like, a week of religious discussions…that, at times,drove me nuts and had little or nothing to do with the FLDS. There have been travel comments, gardening tips, and all sorts of unrelated stuff here. So the comment about remaining on topic…is sorta silly, since the topic bends and waves all over the place. When I didn’t like the current topic, I just waited until it was over and rejoined the discussion when it was something I wanted to comments on. So, in my unsolicited opinion…..get over it. I personally, don’t need someone to be a moral compass about what we should or should not be discussing. That’s why there is an Admin person here. In my opinipn, this blog belongs to ALL who wish to post here, until the FLDS Admin says they can’t. Ya don’t like what someone posts, then move on and wait for a new topic. But don’t go gettin’ all high horse and nasty about it.

  534. I had dinner this evening, with a friend that I’ve worked with for many years. Tonight, I mentioned this blog, in passing, and he looked at me and said..I’m told I had ‘family’ on the ranch when it was raided! After I picked my jaw up off my dinner plate, he went on. He’d left Utah and the mormon church many years ago because he is gay and the church was not welcoming. I tried to pick his brain for surnames,, but he can’t remember much of his life in Utah or what an old aunt told him last year. She talked about CC/Hilldale and people by the last name of “Posey”? He vaguely remembers the name from childhood. But he does remember ‘extra wives’ that some uncles had.
    I was trying to go back and read some of the YFZ documents, looking for the name Posey, but didn’t find it. Does it ring a bell with anyone? Or was the old aunt just confused?
    I plan on sitting him down and picking his brain, a bit more, as soon as I can. I sent him the link to this and Blue’s blog hoping he’ll read and maybe remember stuff he has forgotten/blocked out. It could be interesting!!

  535. mc1199 the name Posey has a long history in Utah. It would be interesting to know more.

  536. Rebeckah- For what it is worth Hugh has a screw loose and howls at one side of the moon. BillM howls on the other side.

    Hugh likes to stir up trouble and calls it Justice. What ever.
    He’d love to see this kind of attention.

    Does any of this have anything to do with following the FLDS.

    Yes. There is a connection. Should Hugh and his rants be discussed here? As I said there is a connection.

    You stay. And GFNY stay. You both have posted wonderful posts and provided information that helps some of us out here put pieces together.

    I’m not from Texas so I hope I am saying this right…Ya’ll stay here and keep posting.

  537. Walton, you said it right. You could go *real* redneck and say, “Y’all stay here and keep on a-postin’ …”

    And I echo the sentiment. Would hate to see either Rebeckah or GFNY quit commenting. They are both valuable contributors and I’ve learned a lot from them.

    Them’s my two cents’ worth. :-)

  538. Well, I read Hugh once in a while, as do many other people – as Hugh would happily tell you.

    The reason that he was mentioned, and will continue to be a point of discussion, is his mad blog keeps spitting out crazy rants. The request that he not be discussed is rather presumptuous, as said rants are often pointed at FLDS and related issues of polygamy, cults and child sex assault in general – and as I recall he approves of the latter, in the polygamist setting of course, which makes it a cool thing for Hugh.

    That he trots his various family members onto his blog is a sick matter, but a situation he created himself and attempts to spam the internet with. So comments about such are fair game, sorry. His solution, if this were to offend him, would be to simply delete his blog, or clean it up to the point its nearly deleted anyway.

    Since he wont allow discussion on his board, the discussion he generates is brought elsewhere – here, TBM, SLT, Brookes trib plyg blog, Honeydawn, you name it.

    The man makes many points that simply need to be addressed. Yes, since he wont allow discussion and his rants are so fantastical he is generally made fun of, but with the stuff he floats, its his burden, or gift, if you will. Alucifer in Wonderland.

    Many people dont read him. And thats OK. However, If YOU HAD READ, before being kicked out of his Church, and perhaps the reason for it, was his invoking his White Supremacist ARYAN NATION friends like Randy Weaver and others who are in prison, in the PARAGRAPH BEFORE saying he was going to “spill out into the aisles of my Church” which in anyones mind sounds like a threat, esp in this era where monthly we have some idiot killing people because they snapped.

    So, his latest crazy is this:

    “(Emack – FLDS) Plead out so that (they) can challenge the constitutionality of a bigamy law. My work may be done soon.”

    See here, he is drooling over the prospect that bigamy laws will be overturned in Texas then nationally, and he can sit on a fence and crow like a rooster.

    (not that he could do anything about it)

    He professes to be married, but I ask, what woman would want to stay with such a fool who is working so hard to break his marriage vows?

  539. In all fairness, I would not want to see GFNY, Rattle or Rebeckah stop posting. They all have valuable insights. It is important to note that the Pharisee does not permit discussion on his site, so this site does allow those of us to disagree to post our opinions.
    It is also important to note that nothing that was said about Pharisee in the context of the recent discussion was rumor or ungrounded speculation. He clearly stated on the Biblical Families chat board that he wanted to start a polygynous trailer park in an underpopulated town in the West, and then he wanted to take over the local government. Sounds a lot like the tactics of the FLDS if you ask me. See his discussion here : http://www.biblicalfamilies.org/forum2/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=1232#p12167&utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter
    The Pharisee also believes that a first wife has no say as to whether or not her husband takes a second, third, or fourth wife.
    I have never met a first wife who freely consented to her husband’s polygynous second marriage, and I don’t think polygyny should ever be legal, nor should it be decriminalized.
    See The Pharisee’s statements here : http://www.biblicalfamilies.org/forum2/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=1064&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&sid=6d195ba1771ffabe892e1beb6b4e7518&start=10

  540. An important note :
    There are an estimated 60,000 fundamentalist Mormon polygamists in the US.
    There are an estimated 100,000 Muslim polygynists in the US.
    There is a much smaller population of so called Christian polygynists in the US, probably less than 5,000 – 10,000 at the very most.
    Polygyny is a problem which is not unique to FLDS, nor is it a problem unique to Texas.
    Wherever religious polygyny is practiced, women and children are at risk, according to established medical data.
    Therefore I believe that analysis of the activities of all polygynous groups is germane to the discussion.

  541. CW

    Good find! The offending missive in the latter post:

    Hugh on his soapbox sez:

    “I’m going to come down on the side that it’s none of the wife’s business who her husband takes as another wife, unless he deprives her in the ways described in Exodus 21, but a good manager/husband sure doesn’t act like a bull in a China Shop. ”

    For some reason that “Bull in a China Shop” quote was already in my head before I read that!

    Any way, if his so-called wife had any so-called internet skills, she would know what kind of cad she was hitched too.

  542. CW

    Compare those numbers to illegal drugs and illegal aliens, both which number in the millions, and its easy to see how they have flown under the radar for so long.

    Especially since the victims rarely speak up, and are held in virtual slavery under threat of damnation.

    Its frustrating to see the abuse continue, and its probably the reason why many people vilify those who try to glamorize and decriminilize child molestation.

  543. Hugh is on a mission. Google Hugh McBryde and google until your eyes grow tired.

    Hugh says his mission is about the right to practice polygamy and he stumbled upon friends in the Aryan Nation. Anyone ever think that maybe it is the other way around?

    Does anyone remember the fake license plates? They bought them from the Little Shell Pembina Band which is known to have connections with the Aryan Nation, posee Comitatus etc. Bad stuff. Real Bad.

    Little Shell Pembina Band was also part of that big immigration stink down in Florida a few years back. They have known members all over but I’ve seen the issues in Washington, Idaho, North Dakota, South Dakota, Utah, Arizona, Florida, Montana etc.

    In the land of Hughs posting world you will find that Hugh has done some traveling.

    So maybe Hughs connection with his buddies didn’t come after his interest in Polygamy but the other way around?

    Hugh is wound tighter than a rubber band.

    Hugh has no problem dragging other people around including his own family members. But he enjoys his preying and pouncing like an old farm cat.

    His enjoyment from trying to be number one at something anything is scary. He wants to be known for something, anything. That has been apparent with him going after Rozitta, someone in the Baptist Church etc.

    Yup, wound tighter than a rubber band that man is.

  544. Walton, indeed.

    Last year he was posting how his wife made it a condition that he become a member of their church, and he not only failed at that in his passive aggressive way, he finally went full agro on them and he was booted from the premises.

    This should send a clear, loud message to Mrs McBryde.

    If he was interested in his marriage and Church he would give up those two websites.

    But instead he is frank to them and shows them his blog is the thing that he really cares about. Indeed its no secret, and the Church leaders need to have been counseling his wife over it.

  545. agro = aggression, aggravation

  546. http://flds101.blogspot.com/2009/05/flds-people-101-others-told-to-pack-up.html

    Another backgrounder on some of the men (other than the Barlow Boys) were were exed in Warren’s snit of 1-2004.

  547. Thanks Twist

    FLDS101 is really letting it fly!

    Its always good to see the truth hit the light of day!

  548. The truth will reveal, Stamp.

  549. Looks like not only was Hugh ordered off the premises of his Church, his name has been forwarded to the police who will inforce this “NO TRESPASS” order.

    From Hugh himself.

    http://docs.google.com/fileview?id=0BwUXfGcfXHWsYzRjZjI3YmEtMjc2YS00MjM4LThjYzAtNTlmMzVmOTNhYjlm&hl=en

  550. Twist

    Indeed, 3 for 3 HAS been revealing! Is there any dignity left that the FLDS could recover?

  551. Dunno, Stamp, but it will only get worse before it can get better as more and more of Warren’s novel is published for the public eye.

  552. Its almost enough to make a Prophet break bricks with his bonehead!

  553. Wherever religious polygyny is practiced, women and children are at risk, according to established medical data.
    Therefore I believe that analysis of the activities of all polygynous groups is germane to the discussion.
    …………………………..

    The United Nations considers polygamy to be human rights abuse. I have a hard time believing that our Federal government would legalize or even decriminalize something most of the world condemns. We couldn’t begin to criticize the subjugation of women under religious dictatorships like the Taliban if we allow similar abuse right here in our own country.

  554. Any way, if his so-called wife had any so-called internet skills, she would know what kind of cad she was hitched too.

    …………………….

    Philip Garrido’s wife knew exactly what he had done, furthermore she helped him do it.

  555. Please continue on Discussion Thread #24

    Also, please refrain from personal attacks or assigning rules to the blog. The topics, and “Open Discussion” in general, are open to a variety of viewpoints. – Thanks, ADMIN

  556. Stamp take an internet travel to Montana and Idaho.

    Sometimes that old gut feeling is just from bad cooking (hardly ever) and sometimes there is that gut feeling is there for other reasons.

    Pending on your google set up and the words a person uses it could take you into pages 5 and 6 on the google flight.

  557. Anon E Mouse you should follow the news from Utah.
    Check out the photos from the National Geographic Website. There is a picture of Merril and others from the FLDS being served lunch with the local AG office. It appears they are having a good ol time yucking it all up while being served lunch by the women of the group.

    There was a huge amount of land purchased by the CPark group.

    Mark Shurtleff takes walks in the park with those from the CPark Group.

    Merger? I would think so.

    It appears that Utah is doing everything they can to encourage the continuation of Polygamy Groups in Utah.

    Lots of land bought.

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